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So I'm pretty experienced with dog training, but I was wondering how easily trainable spoos are? Many places say bordercollies are easy to train, but they arnt.. erm to rephrase they are so smart they learn things you didn't want to teach them like how to open doors and all sorts of other mischif. and If they found out giving a cute look gets them lots of attention they'll manipulate you and training gets hard when the rest of your family gives into their ploys.

So I was wondering if spoos, being the second smartest breed have similar difficulties when training?

Also what sort of collar would you suggest? For the other dogs Ive trained Ive always used martingale collars on lean dogs or mischevious breeds like border collies who seem to figure out a way to escape anything if they want to. But I have also seen at petsmart a few newer collars (or new to me)


Fur- saver: a chain color (does not pull shut like a chokechain) with thin metal links so the fur can poke through

escape proof webbing collar (not actuall name I just forgot what its called ._.) It functions like a martingale in that if the dog pulls the collar tightens on all sides except the trachea so the dog cant escape but wont choke its self. its soft but imo it looks easy to chew through for a puppy

cushin collar- a normal buckle collar that is made of some kind of soft material and padded inbetween layers with a squishy shock absorbing matterial. its thick enough for a pup not to chew through easily and atleast when I put it onmyself lessons choking, I still felt difficulty breathing but it was more or less a hug around the neck rather than a suffocating head lock.

And then there were all manners of flashy collars with embroidery, studs, reflectors, ect lol

Whats best for a poodle in your opinions?


also leashes, Ive got a nice leather(maybe fauxleather?) leash, 2 nylon leashes (1 standard 6ft, 1 14ft ) a retractable heavy duty leash, and for style a light chain leash 7ft with a leather handle and a nifty clip that I can attach to my belt.

A note on retractable leashes I only use them in open areas not near roads and I always teach my dogs the heel command, so on leasurly walks they are allowed to roam, I usually make them heel until we get to some place like a park then I swap out the nylon leash for the retractable and let them do what ever they want, if they are ready for it at that time ill let them go off leash.
 

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From my experience, it depends on the poodle. Riley is Super smart (in puppy class, the first time teaching sit, i showed him how once, and then asked him the second time and he did it on his own without luring or anything!, teaching speak was a 3min. process). Riley is not the manipulative type though, well not with me. :) He knows he doesnt have to listen to my family as they wont make him (like move, lay down, etc, he is very well mannered in general for everyone though). It is a joy to train Riley as he does "get it" very quickly.
A client i know who has a female standard is quite the opposite though! She is a smart as a whip girl, but she is smarter then her owner. She Knew she didnt have to listen to the owner as the owner wouldnt reinforce any command. The poodle just completely ignorned her. Now, 2 years later they are starting to work more as a team. The owner commended that she thought the dog was always just dumb. The dog was infact just too smart for her!

One thing with training poodles if you never have. They are a Very sensitive breed! You cannot train a poodle like you train a lab. I thought i understood that before i got Riley, but i really didnt. Riley shuts down if he things he is doing it wrong, you dont praise him, you correct him, etc. I have had to learn how to train different with him, but its been a wonderful journey.

P.S.- where in IL do you live?
 

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They are pretty smart dogs, and can out think you though a lot of them I notice don't seem to try that. Jazz doesn't at any rate nor have the other spoo's I have worked with.
The spoo that come through my classes, and we have a lot in this area I usualy have at least one in every class, are a lot like golden's training wise. I suppose I'm not surprised considering their orgional purpose. They are usually happy, eager workers and they enjoy learning.

The thing peolpe here seem to have problems with is the fact that they are higher energy than maybe what they expected. So if you don't give them an outlet they will find one with or without you. This is where I see most of my behavior problems. Behaviors like jumping, sometimes barking, getting so excited they cannot control themselves, and pulling on lead are the most common that I see. I also see social issues from time to time, shy poodles, not often though. I have one right now that I've been working with a year, I also groom her, and she has all of those issues, except being shy. I will probably be working on them until she dies because she just doesn't get the energy outlets she needs and momma isn't consistant. Nothing I say seems to sink in with her owner. As with any dog the rules have to be the same all the time sit means sit the first time I say every time not the 18th time. She behaves perfectly for me, she runs all over momma.
I have only had two with any type of agression issues one was agressive for grooming, and the other displayed "agression" on leash. Both are the results of poor training. The leash issue was resolved quickly the dog with the grooming problem I believe bit a family member and was euthanized, I was no longer working with them at that time. I heard it from another trainer last year. They were the type of people though who really wanted a magic pill to just fix the problem they had caused (I won't go into detail but suffice it to say they DID cause the problem and what they were doing was abusive in my opinion). They bounced from trainer to trainer not following through really with anything. I'm sure the dog had other issues by the time they put it down but I don't know for sure.

I use maringale collars on ALL of my dogs, period. Jazz can quickly and easily slip her head out of a regular buckel collar. I like a rolled leather buckle collar too if you're going to be keeping much hair on your dog. It'll help a bit with preventing matting. If/when I clip them into a style with short or no neck hair I might want a flashy fancy collar to look perdy on them. When out of the house though it is ALWAYS the martingale, no exceptions. We chased Jazz all over downtown Tallahasee in rushhour and lost her the same day we adopted her :( I was devestated and we looked until well past midnight but then had to make the drive home without her, we lived two hours away. Lucky for us, and her, she was picked up and taken to the shelter the next morning and we were able to locate her the next day and I drove to get her the day after that. She wore two slip leads and a harness with a leash home from the shelter and went to petsmart the next day to be fitted for a martingale.
I also tend to use gentle leaders alot when out in public, especialy now that I'm preggers. Both my girls are pretty good on leash but occasionaly they "forget" especialy if a squirrle is involved :)
Also with being a trainer having the leader on one or both of the dogs I get the chance to talk to new people and answer questions, and often get people interesting in taking classes. People always ask if it's a muzzle which is how the conversation starts.

I hate flexie leads in public or crowded places or indoors in places like petsmart, but thats just me, they are wonderful for wide open areas and sometimes my little dogs use them if we go to the park. I don't let the spoo's use them because of the squirrle issue. The last thing I need is to give them 15 or 20 feet to build up speed before hitting the end... Normaly they would respond to leave it but hey you never can be to careful, especialy now for me. The spoo's generaly walk on four foot leads as a rule and train on anything from 6 to 30 feet. I do hands free type training so the longer lead is normaly cliped to my belt.

I don't ever use chain leashes because they are harder to handle/grab and grip onto. If yours is clipped onto your belt though I wouldn't imagine that would be a problem. I can't allow them in classes because I once had a client use one to whip at his dog. *shakes head* Some people....

Ok I'll stop rambling now... I knew I shouldn't have replied to this post Haha - sorry. I usualy avoid training posts.
 

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Well Mister is my first Spoo but ive been arount others and have groomed them in the past and my overall opinion is that they are very intelligent and pick up on you body language very well.
I can get Mister to sit or come just by looking at him. He knows my version or sign language and i only tell him a few times and hes got something new.
The only thing is that he is young (will be 2 in January) so he is hyper. I still need to work with him on settling down when meeting new humans and dogs. He will sit nicely for a second then jump up and want to play with the person and their dog.
I have been told by other Standard Poodle owners that they dont calm down until they are 4! I hope this isnt true lol.

Overall i love love love the breed and will own more in the future. I am definately stuck on the breed lol.

Hope this helps.

Oh and i use a show choke collar on Mister for walks, etc because the links are so small and close together that it doesnt tear any coat out or tangle. Its really a great training collar too. I picked mine up at a dog show however i do not ever leave it on because he is White and it changes his coat a dingy kind of grey color. Not cool.

I also walk him with a very thin (almost looks like a show lead) 4 foot leather lead. From the get go he had never pulled and a 6 foot leash is just too long.
 

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well thanks for your opinion, I appreciated every bit of your rambling lol.
haha, well I hope you got something out of the rambling. I just re-read that and noticed that once again I am the run on sentance and typo queen. :)


Mister; I am starting to believe that 4 years old therory lol. I have several clients that are two and in spite of everything are nuts. The good kind of nuts, don't get me wrong. We're talking happy, hyper, goofy type dogs. I am very grateful that at least while out in public our 9 mo old is a bit more laid back than the average.
 

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Mandy is my tiny girl at35 lbs she would run like the wind when I opened the door just to run. At 2 she is really calmed down and enjoys a good run but mostly meanders around yard now.
Casey used to be a calm chilled out pup but now at almost 2 he has turned into crazy dog LOL forgets all manners when meeting people just jumps to the moon thinking someone is coming to love on him.
Runs no where in perticular outside just runs and can play fetch for hours. He isn't the sharpets crayon in the box either.
Just a big ol loveable goof without a mean bone in his body and is a joy to be around even if a littly hyper as he is so goofy.
He has always been very imature though so figure he will take till about 3 to calm down

Both are different as night is day but both a joy
 

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I've actually been VERY lucky with Vega, he's been a joy to train and work with, i've never had an issue with leash pulling he walks right at my side (unless we see birds or sqiurrels then it's the end of the world!)

As far as obedience goes he's done excellent..however he will without hesitation open the fridge, clear the counter of any food within minutes, he loves whisky for some reason and once started lapping it from my roommates glass he can do some pretty neat little tricks that he found out on his own.

I believe poodles are common countersurfers because both of mine will actually do it if you turn your back for too long.

I keep rolled leather collars on the dogs for every day wear although I have a nice martingale for Dodger that I got from dogsinstyle.com I believe.

For walking I keep martingales on any dog I walk, none have slipped a collar but it would be easy to do so I don't risk it.

I do have a fur saver for my shepherd but I dont use it like a choke chain I keep the leash clipped to the dead ring so that it doesnt work as a slip collar. In fact they make very poor correction collars from what I can tell. I believe these collars were more designed for easy off and on just slipping over the head.
 

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My spoo is almost 2 years old now...he has definitely calmed down, but there is still a little further to clam! I am a first time dog owner/trainer so I don't know of other breeds to compare. I definitely agree with some of the above comments that Standards are very sensitive and do not respond to aggresive training. If I could start again, the one thing I would try to do different is be absolutey 100% consistent 100% of the time. I swear they keep score and if he was ever allowed to do something, even if it was the very first day I got him, he seems to remember! I am constantly challenged by Schumann to keep being the "pack leader"...And I agree that no matter how much training I still find the odd roll of toliet paper shredded!

I have tried many leashes as my boy is not naturally walking calmly beside me. In the end my vet recommended a small size pinch. This seems to work great for me compared to a martingale and he hardly needs any corrections on walks anymore. Definitely get a Spoo if want a killer smart dog with personality!
 

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They are almost too easy to train! When we got Lorelei I was still trying to connect with the year old mixed breed we had rescued six months earlier. After he practically started shutting down emotionally/mentally in training classes I finally had a trainer come to the house to help me out.
 

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Hmm, wasn't done.

Anyway, between sessions with the trainer Lorelei would "sit in" with us while Jethro and I were working on his stuff. She was picking up just about everything just by watching. The end result is that she hasn't really gotten the attention she should as far as training. While she has the basics there are a lot of finishing touches we are going to have to work on. Even with that she's ahead of Jethro in many ways.

With Jethro I use an electronic collar with a very low level of stimulation, sometimes all he needs is a tone and sometimes not even that when I realize that I've forgotten to turn it on, lol. I don't think that will be the way to go with her though other than possible just training her to the tone for times when she gets a little further out (we have a bunch of property so the do get to run quite a bit)

I've always like martingale collars best, there seems to be less room for error than the standard "choke" collar. I think a lot depends on both the dog and the trainer though.
 
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