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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
There are dogs listed under the Dam who are not listed in the regular generational pedigree...who are they?

To be more specific, and why I ask...I see two of the Dam's siblings are kitsue. Does that mean they were SOLD to Kitsue or that the sire was also kitsue or just that one of the sire's parents was also bred with kitsue or ? I don't understand all these naming conventions! Just wondering how my baby is related to a puppy mill, I guess. :(

ETA: OOPS, I meant listed under the Dam's name...
 

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I might be mistaken but I think the dogs listed under the dam are the ones that are related to her. If the dogs listed under the sire's name are kitsue then yes those dogs are related to your dog. If you want you can PM me the pedigree but I'm hoping that someone else that knows more about reading pedigrees can chime in here. I just wanted to bump this up for you.
 

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Can you provide a link to the pedigree?

You see why following naming convention is so helpful. It helps tell someone looking at a pedigree who bred a dog. Traditionally, the kennel name of the bitch owner goes on the puppies.

Beauvoir's Swing on a Star.

If someone buys a puppy or gets a puppy as a stud fee then they can put their kennel name somewhere in the registered name:

Beauvoir Cascade Swing on a Star
Beauvoir Swing on a Star at Cascade

It is very bad form to buy a dog and then put your kennel name first in the registered name.
 

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Yes - it is bad but done unfortunately. But not often and usually it gets known very fast. Still - name stays in the pedigree :doh:
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Okay, this is Bella's link, then from there you can click around. It looks like, I THINK, some of her "aunts" on her mother's side say Kit-Sue... but I really don't know how to read all this. And what does that mean? That her mother was one of theirs or this woman bought siblings of her mother? And while I'm at it, what else is in her lineage that is a red flag, or otherwise? Of course I love her just the same and she's our family member not a show dog or to be bred, but I do want to learn more about this:

http://www.poodlepedigree.com/fivegen.asp?ID=375682
I'll probably remove this in a couple of days when I get skittish! LOL, but thank you for your help.
 

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Not much to tell you good or bad. The dogs in her pedigree don't come from well known or infamous kennels. Looks like basic BYB stuff so I don't have any gossip about any of the dogs in the first 4 generations. Have you tried looking on www.poodlehealthregistry.com

The Kit-Sue folks bought a sibling of Bella's dam and put their name on it.:fish: Nice of them to sell a breeding dog to such a high volume breeder.

The one thing I can tell from the vertical pedigree is that Bella's mom is Silver and lots of her full siblings were either Silver or Blue. Based on this, I'm not sure that Bella is going to hold her brown color. I would expect her to be Cafe in a couple of years.
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Thank you. I clicked on that site once but saw you needed to register so I didn't continue. I will check it out later.

From what I can tell Bella's mother came from a person who has a website selling doodles. :( I don't know where she got her from. So it's not like I had high hopes for lineage there. Then she was bought by the the people who bred her to their male.

I know, there's not a lot of brown in her background. She was sold to me knowing that, though so we're enjoying her chocolate coat in the meantime. They thought she'd be a silver-beige but now in more reading here I'm thinking "grizzled brown" but who really knows. She's developed a cute creme spot on her tail.
 

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Sigh....

Further looking based on what you said. Bella' dam came from a breeder who bred Carefree Huggee Bear at least 6 times to Silver Creek Raven Romeo. Those puppies have ended up in a variety of BYBs and high volume breeders breeding both Poodles and Doodles.
 
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