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I never liked grain free but I did buy it because everyone seemed to be so amazed by it.

I’m almost finished switching mine to Pro plan sensitive. I went very slow, more than 4 weeks, and so far so good.

Remember the old days when grain free didn’t exist and dogs lived long lives without problems ? There must be a reason.
So glad to hear that the switch to PPP Sensitive Skin and Stomach has gone well. I hear lots of good things about that formula.
 

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Discussion Starter #22

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When I took Miracle to her first vet appointment last year the vet asked what I was feeding her. I started her on Taste of the Wild (grain free), because that's what Jasper eats. The veterinary practice actually sells Royal Canin, but my vet told me to keep my dog on TOTW because she claimed it's actually a higher quality food as compared to Royal Canin. Miracle is due for her annual appointment soon....I am going to bring this topic up and see what the vet says.
 

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Is there a specific research article that cites this? Thanks.
There are dozens of articles and research papers published on a facebook group called Taurine-deficient Dialeted Cardiomyopathy

If you join that group there is a section called UNITS where you can read research by UCDavis Cardiologist Dr. Joshua Stern also there are research papers published by Dr Lisa Freeman who is a veterinary nutritionist, and there are published papers by Tufts University as well. I am unable to share directly from that group.

You could go to this link, as I believe most of the published research is there as well. https://taurinedcm.org

I spent about a month reading and absorbing all the information, then I made the switch to Purina Pro Plan for Poppy.
 

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Well, apparently, after reading those articles and the links found within, taurine deficiency is only partly associated with the increase in DCM. It seems that the defiency is mostly found in certain breeds, such as GR. But the DCM is being seen more and more in dogs and they don't have a taurine deficiency. So, apparently that's not the whole story.

It looks like it may well be the fact that they're using in many foods too much pea protein and legumes and not enough meat. That's like the filler of choice...not grain, not enough meat either way. They're cheaping out on meat, as we all know already. So I am looking at foods (now when I'm feeding commercial. Yuk) that don't even list peas or legumes, even though a little is okay. I'm looking for meat, meat and more meat. 85-95% protein from.......................................................................you guessed it. MEAT! lol.

By products are apparently just fine. I didn't know what bi products exactly entailed. Not entrails. But my goodness...some good stuff! https://www.jhvet.com/pet-food-labels.pml

A common myth is that meat by-products are dangerous and not wholesome for pets to eat. According to AAFCO meat in pet food is defined as the clean flesh derived from slaughtered mammals, and is limited to that part of the striate muscle which is skeletal or that which is found in the tongue, in the diaphragm, in the heart, or in the esophagus; with or without the accompanying and overlying fat and the portions of the skin, sinew, nerve and blood vessels which normally accompany the flesh. Meat by-products are the clean parts, other than meat, derived from slaughtered mammals. It includes, but is not limited to, lungs, spleen, kidneys, brain, livers, blood, bone, partially defatted low temperature fatty tissue, and stomachs and intestines freed of their contents. It does not include hair, horns, teeth and hoofs. Animals are meat eaters and must eat more than just muscle meat to survive. Just watch any wild animal take down prey and you will notice that the choice part of the prey to eat is the abdominal organs not the leg meat.
I kind of wish it did include some hair because that acts as fiber. They don't set out to eat hair purposely but when hunting and taking down prey, they wind up with some of the hair and that should be good for digestion. Oh well.

Dogs don't seem to get celiac disease so gluten free is only helpful for allergies or dogs that have some special need...a very low percentage. (that goes for people too.) Gluten, otherwise is good for you. I hate how the food manufacturers take some gimmick and run with it...bragging about their gluten free food. It doesn't matter for 99% of humans. And there's some good protein in it apparently.

I have a love/hate relationship with the idea of grain in dog food. I don't think it's evil and it may help with digestibility and some other things. HOWEVER, archaeological records show that arthritis didn't exist in humans or animals prior to the agricultural era...when people began growing or gathering grains. So between the hunter-gatherer era and the agricultural era is when joint disease and tooth decay went from non existent to prevalent. So I'm a little hesitant about using much grain.

Bottom line...they say they don't quite know what is causing this. Investigations still under way. But it looks very much like this replacing meat with peas and lentils, too many seeds etc may be the culprit. Grain is often used as a filler and if they're leaving out that and using peas and legumes as fillers instead, that may also be what the problem is. I don't believe it's the lectins in legumes because cooking them negates that problem. I do not get why grain in and of itself prevents DCM. That doesn't make sense to me. But not putting in enough meat and taking up that space with pea protein instead means there are many amino acids and things that come only from meat that they may be missing.

I notice that the food, Victor has no peas or legumes. Looks like it has a little grain. But what I think looks good is that it has a high percentage of protein from meat. I do wonder though, about the processing of dry food. It scares me. But then...all these years that our dogs have eaten this stuff. I had a child hood dog live to 18, another to 15, others almost that long.

Here's another article. Sorry if it's been posted and I've lost track. I have about a million tabs opened and I may be duplicating something. But this is food for thought.

https://truthaboutpetfood.com/is-it-peas-processing-or-a-combination/
 
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