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Discussion Starter #1
We do not feed our tpoo people food when we are at home. BUT, when we visit dad and have dinner, which is about once a week, dad shares his meat with him. He can't resist that little face :)

Last time we were there we happened to have steamed broccoli and carrots, so we cut some up really small and mixed it with steamed chicken.

One other time he only had grilled chicken, wolfed it down, and never wanted another morsel of food for the rest of the day. That probably was my fault by giving him too much.

At all other times he gets Stella & chewy Lil Bites beef or duck. We also give him a probiotic in about a half teaspoon of plain yogurt, and 2 frozen cherries.

I want to make little packets of add ons to leave at dad's to add to whatever protein we're eating. I want to give sweet potato, broccoli, carrots, and brown rice. I was going to give regular potato, but the little guy goes nuts for yams :)

We feed him about 1/2 cup of food a day and I'm thinking a TABLESPOON of the above mixture would be enough to add to his food. Perhaps 3 teaspoons would also work.

What are your thoughts? I will prepare and portion it all, freeze, and leave with dad.
 

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Discussion Starter #2
I wanted to add that I just mixed up the following:

1/2 cup of each
chopped broccoli florets
chopped up sweet potato
chopped up carrot
brown rice

I'm not sure those proportions are correct, but I figured it's better than nothing. I portioned a little more than a tablespoon to bring to dad's house today.
 

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For a tpoo I would use one tablespoon and not a hugely heaping one. One of the best things our vet told us when Lily was a puppy was to give no human food at all. He said if you stick to a balanced dog appropriate diet you will never end up with an overweight poodle. Overweight/obese dogs are much more seriously at risk for musculoskeletal injuries, episodes of acute pancreatitis if fed fatty foods, chronic pancreatitis if snacks are ongoing and possibly diabetes just to name a few things. Our dogs are fed human grade home cooked food, but in dog appropriate portions. If we are going to give them a super special treat like birthday or title steak dinner they are not given their regular dinner to offset excess calories and fat.
 
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Discussion Starter #4
Thank you so much. Growing up, my tpoo got half dog food and half whatever protein we were eating, so my dad just automatically cuts up whatever he has. He's nearly 90 and loves the little guy :) I no longer bring dog food with me, hence why I wanted to know if a tablespoon was enough.

The only snacks he gets are dehydrated apples during the day, and we sometimes give a milk bone at night.

The little guy really doesn't have much interest in eating during the day. Occasionally he does, which is why I put it out mid-day, but most often he eats it all at night.

I have been toying with the idea of cooking for him. Can you direct me to some recipes? It's probably just as easy to cook and freeze into portions as it is to feed freeze dried raw dry.
 

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3 teaspoons = 1 tablespoon.

Too much. I would not give him broccoli. Yams or sweet potatoes are fine, but just enough that it would be one nibble for him. Cooked carrots are good also, but just a little slice.

If you want to make homemade, check out raw. It is much simpler than cooking. Basic predator raw is a raw meaty bone sized to the dog. So my border collie got a chicken leg quarter twice a day, the Bostons got a chicken leg quarter, but I cut them into drumstick and thigh for twice a day. Another dog might get a chicken wing. Cut liver, any species except polar bear, into the size of the dog's front paw. Freeze. Give one piece of liver twice a week. Give another organ meat once a week. When feeding raw eggs, (my border collie preferred them lightly scrambled) also give the shell. That is basic. Adding the yam, carrot, etc as a little topper or as a separate treat is all he would need.
 

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This is my basic recipe and as noted the amounts are the daily portion for a 45 pound dog, so you would adjust your portions accordingly. You could substitute any other protein so long as you know calories er ounce to substitute the correct weight. This recipe was developed based on my usable ingredients using a computer program that I don't have (there wasn't a Mac version) so it is calorically adequate and nutritionally complete.


FOR A 45 POUND DOG PER DAY (divide into two portions)

8 oz chicken (I use boneless, skinless legs and thighs from Costco and sometimes add chicken hearts)
0.75 cup macaroni (I use whole grain rotini or penne)
4 chicken livers
3 teaspoons bone meal
2 scoops (scoop being 1/8 tsp.) kelp powder
3 cups spinach (I use bagged organic mixed spinach, kale and chards from Costco and grind it with water in a nutribullet)_
0.5 teaspoon canola oil
0.5 tsp cod liver or other fish oil (I use mega red krill oil)

For changes, if you eliminate the cod liver oil, the recipe provides 0% of the daily recommended serving of Vitamin D. You could replace it with a vitamin D supplement. This is what I have done.

Eliminating the liver and replacing it with chicken meat makes the recipe low in Copper, Zinc, Selenium, B5, B12, and Choline. I have not found a replacement yet, but you might be able to.

Of course, you can replace the fish oil with another omega 3 source.

The recipe is for 1083 calories of food, it's one day’s food for a hypothetical 45lb dog.

The kelp powder, a scoop is 1/8 teaspoon, so it's really tiny. If you are substituting Vitamin D for the cod liver oil, you'd need 200 IU per day for that amount of food.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
3 teaspoons = 1 tablespoon.

Too much. I would not give him broccoli. Yams or sweet potatoes are fine, but just enough that it would be one nibble for him. Cooked carrots are good also, but just a little slice.

If you want to make homemade, check out raw. It is much simpler than cooking. Basic predator raw is a raw meaty bone sized to the dog. So my border collie got a chicken leg quarter twice a day, the Bostons got a chicken leg quarter, but I cut them into drumstick and thigh for twice a day. Another dog might get a chicken wing. Cut liver, any species except polar bear, into the size of the dog's front paw. Freeze. Give one piece of liver twice a week. Give another organ meat once a week. When feeding raw eggs, (my border collie preferred them lightly scrambled) also give the shell. That is basic. Adding the yam, carrot, etc as a little topper or as a separate treat is all he would need.
Thanks. He already has freeze dried raw. I'm looking for something to add to his meal at dad's. I'm still on the fence about cooking, and I definitely don't want to do regular raw.

As for the broccoli. It's already in his food. S&C and Primal add it. I know that too much isn't good for them. I mixed in slightly less than 1/2 cup.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
This is my basic recipe and as noted the amounts are the daily portion for a 45 pound dog, so you would adjust your portions accordingly. You could substitute any other protein so long as you know calories er ounce to substitute the correct weight. This recipe was developed based on my usable ingredients using a computer program that I don't have (there wasn't a Mac version) so it is calorically adequate and nutritionally complete.


FOR A 45 POUND DOG PER DAY (divide into two portions)

8 oz chicken (I use boneless, skinless legs and thighs from Costco and sometimes add chicken hearts)
0.75 cup macaroni (I use whole grain rotini or penne)
4 chicken livers
3 teaspoons bone meal
2 scoops (scoop being 1/8 tsp.) kelp powder
3 cups spinach (I use bagged organic mixed spinach, kale and chards from Costco and grind it with water in a nutribullet)_
0.5 teaspoon canola oil
0.5 tsp cod liver or other fish oil (I use mega red krill oil)

For changes, if you eliminate the cod liver oil, the recipe provides 0% of the daily recommended serving of Vitamin D. You could replace it with a vitamin D supplement. This is what I have done.

Eliminating the liver and replacing it with chicken meat makes the recipe low in Copper, Zinc, Selenium, B5, B12, and Choline. I have not found a replacement yet, but you might be able to.

Of course, you can replace the fish oil with another omega 3 source.

The recipe is for 1083 calories of food, it's one day’s food for a hypothetical 45lb dog.

The kelp powder, a scoop is 1/8 teaspoon, so it's really tiny. If you are substituting Vitamin D for the cod liver oil, you'd need 200 IU per day for that amount of food.
Thank you. This recipe would cover me for a week :) :) :) He's 8 pounds :)

I really appreciate it. Do you ever give ground beef instead of chicken? My thinking was to cook 2 different proteins and divide up the other things between them and alternate them.
 

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My basic recipe for the dogs is beef and chicken, either a balanced mince that contains organs and ground bone, or 90% muscle meat only with 5% liver and 5% kidney and the appropriate quantity of finely ground eggshell instead of the bone (1 tsp per kilo of meat). I add about 20% vegetables by weight, including sweet potatoes as I have found the dogs need the fibre. A typical boneless batch would be:
4lb muscle meat, chicken and beef mixed
3 oz beef liver
3 oz beef kidney or other organs
6 oz sweet potato and/or carrots or parsnips
3 oz green beans
3 oz whatever other veg I have in the fridge or freezer, including some green leaves like spinach or kale
3 teaspoonfuls eggshell

I don't include pasta or rice as my very small dogs do better on a nutrient dense food.

I sprinkle the eggshell over after it has been portioned out - otherwise it sinks to the bottom and is difficult to distribute evenly.

They get around 100g/3.5 oz of this mix each a day.

Once a week or so they get oily fish (salmon or canned sardines), occasionally eggs, plus seaweed based treats most evenings. And other treats of course!
 
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I do sometimes sub or mix in ground beef. Honestly if it wasn't going to routinely cost at least an extra dollar a pound I might just do mostly ground beef since it is easier to deal with from the cooking front, but although we've saved quite a bit on vet expenses that offset still doesn't make beef routinely affordable.
 
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There is not much difference in the price I pay between chicken and beef, and my dogs are so tiny that what Catherine's get through in a day would probably last them a week! I do try to use beef liver, as it has a rather different nutritional profile and provides some nutrients that are hard to find elsewhere - there is one UK supermarket (Morrisons) that still sells it, along with lots of other organ meats and heart. I have used lamb, pork and rabbit in the past, but the first two tend to be rather too high in fat, and the rabbit is very high in bone and needs careful balancing to avoid problems. Sophy can't eat turkey, and venison and pheasant are expensive and strong smelling, so I keep coming back to chicken and beef.

I am now also trying to keep Tilly cat on a low-phosphorus, adequate protein diet for her early stage kidney disease, which adds another set of challenges. Replacing all the ground bone in the cats' food with eggshell makes a big difference, but too much change - like trying to trick her into eating rice or vegetables - and she simply goes hunting, which defeats the object! After considerable research I have come to the conclusion that protein is not the issue at this stage, and that it is more important to build up her weight by keeping her eating, but juggling different recipes and multiple pans is definitely making the weekly cook up a lot more complicated than it used to be!
 

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Thanks. He already has freeze dried raw. I'm looking for something to add to his meal at dad's. I'm still on the fence about cooking, and I definitely don't want to do regular raw.

As for the broccoli. It's already in his food. S&C and Primal add it. I know that too much isn't good for them. I mixed in slightly less than 1/2 cup.
Broccoli is one of Oliver's favorite foods. He doesn't even care if it's dipped in a bit of blue cheesing dressing, as I often like it :eating:. I think it's great for him and allows for a low-fat, low calorie treat, especially when others of his treat menu may tend to the rich side, like dried chicken liver. The fiber seems good, too.

I do cook up what he and I call stew that's frozen, then thaw a bit at a time to top his breakfast kibble (fed as I leave for work). It isn't a scientifically composed recipe, as I might ought. The mix is either ground chicken or lower fat grassfed beef, sauteed in olive oil, with vegetable mix added, such as peas and carrots, green beans, etc. I drop in a bit of spices usually including a little turmeric. Sometimes I make it a meatloaf and roast instead, and mix in an egg. Again, treat level small addition to his kibble.
 

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mary2e, I used to do therapy dog visits to the nursing home, and despite the "don't feed the dog" rules, there were always exceptions that I could not ignore. Of course i had a Standard Poodle, so a tiny bite here, or there was not going to affect her calorie intake by much. Feeding the dog gave some of the patients so much pleasure... it was the highlight of their day, to be able to give something of value to another being. One man saved a bit of cookie for the dog... not just any bit of a cookie, but one that his wife had made. It was so funny when I met the wife and had to confess the the poodle had been snacking on bits of her homemade cookies. She laughed and said that it made her husband so happy that she had thought of making bigger batches for him to have more to share! Oh no, now that would have made my poodle girl chubby. Anyhow, I know how you feel about letting your dad share something with the dog. It is a trickier when you have a Toy with "limited capacity'' though, ha-ha!
 

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Discussion Starter #15
This is what Gilligan got yesterday from dad... an entire pizzelle (Italian flat cookie) which is made mostly of egg & flour, plus sugar of course :)

We cut up some BBQ (unflavored) chicken - enough to make a half a cup with the tablespoon of veggie mixed in. We gave dried apple as a dessert and he licked the bottom of a vanilla ice cream cup until it was clean.

He ate a single piece of Stella and Chewy lil bite when we got home.

I'm not sure what he got calorie wise, but apparently he's eating enough of what we give him because he's not losing weight. He's 8lbs and the vet said she'd like to see about a pound off him, though he does not look overweight at all.

Dad simply cannot resist his little face, so we leave him some cut up chicken to hand feed. Dad also gave him a few little pieces of spare rib :)

The reason I'm considering home cooking is because he does not eat his dog food with any kind of gusto. Basically, he eats when he's starving (around the 24 hour mark). We put his mixture into his bowl yesterday and he wolfed it down. But I also wonder if it's because it is something different.
 

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Certainly, if you have time & enjoy cooking doggy meals all good
Gilligan will love them & maybe eat a couple of small meals a day
 
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