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Discussion Starter #1
Heya!

I am very tempted to go with the raw diet for when I get my dog as I feel its more natural and best for them,
theres so many ways of doing it I just want to make sure I have got it right.

Being in the UK I can only get food from the uk stores, this is what I am looking at..
Berriewood - Berriewood Pet Supplies



I would like to know...

Is it best to stick to one type of minced meat or vary it?

Would it be too much to eat tripe daily?

is it best to add some veg into it?

what age would be best to start if I got my puppy at 8 weeks?

Is it best to start feeding raw in one go, or start by giving a teaspoon on top of kibble to start with and slowly increase it till switched?

do you still brush your dogs teeth when on raw?



For an adult miniature poodle I have in mind..
1/2 a pack of mince a day (1/4 a pack per meal)
a small amount of mashed sweet potato and carrot(about 1tbs)
1-2 pumps of salmon oil
'billy no mates' (herb mix flea repelant, from CSJ)

Swapping the mince every 2 days to add veriety and tripe into the diet
Dose this sound the right amount of food for a mini?


I have two different dry mixes in mind that I would be happy to use if raw didnt work out, but I thought I would get some more info on raw first.

I wont be getting my puppy for a while but I want to be as prepared as possible!
Thank you in advance!!!!
Rebecca x
 

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The following in green are my answers to your questions from my perspective. I've fed raw since 1997. I come from a very casual-about-the-whole-thing mindset, which might or might not suit your own sensibilities! I feed more or less "prey model raw"--that is, I feed raw meaty bones, organs, and tripe only. No mince, no veggies, no grain. Many others on this board feed raw and I hope they'll chime in with their opinions, too.


Is it best to stick to one type of minced meat or vary it?

It's best to start with one type of meat, usually a "milder" meat like chicken. Not minced, though. Bone-in. As your dog adjusts you can feed a wide variety.

Would it be too much to eat tripe daily?

Some people do, though I think it's quite rich and I only feed it once a week or so.

is it best to add some veg into it?

No. Dogs have no biological need for vegetables. Some people just feel better feeding some, but if you do, grind them thoroughly and make it a small proportion of the diet.

what age would be best to start if I got my puppy at 8 weeks?

From day one.

Is it best to start feeding raw in one go, or start by giving a teaspoon on top of kibble to start with and slowly increase it till switched?

When I switched I went cold turkey.

do you still brush your dogs teeth when on raw?

No. Though some dogs seem to just build tartar more than others and will therefore need more attention regardless of the diet. My corgis, for example, both have clean white teeth with no effort. My Italian Greyhound, though she's also eaten raw all her life, needs a scaling now and then. I'm also trying an enzyme-type tooth cleaner with her. My poodle looks like he'll be in between.

Just my thoughts. You might also check out these sites:

Raw Feeding

Raw Meaty Bones

How to Get Started | Prey Model Raw

--Q
 

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I'm also in the UK - I buy DAF food as they deliver around here. Does the Berriwood mince include bone and offal? If not you need to consider supplementing it. I cook most of the mince for my two - it is more convenient, as even two toy dogs and two cats struggle to get through a block while it is fresh, and Sophy is not keen on raw mince. A miniature pup may have the same problem! I do add some veg for the dogs, but it is probably not essential.

Mine are fed twice a day, and I feed tripe chunks every third or fourth meal. They get half a chicken wing or mixed mince/offal/veg for most of the remaining meals, with sardines or salmon about once a week. I've found even raw meaty bones and chewy tripe are not enough to keep their teeth clean without daily PlaqueOff and brushing.

Another helpful site for diet advice is DogAware.com: Diet & Health Info for Man's Best Friend
 
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I also think the sooner the better for raw. I did not transition. Swizzle went straight to raw with no issue. I started him with chicken for a few weeks and then tried a different protein for several weeks. He eats chicken, turkey, lamb, rabbit, venison and beef. Usually one protein for a three week cycle. I also give him cooked fish. I feed commercial raw and supplement it with raw chicken necks. I also keep some frozen chicken gizzards and hearts on hand in case his poo is too hard. The raw bones keep his teeth pretty clean but I also brush his teeth. I just was able to get raw tripe a couple days ago. The woman at the store said she feeds her dogs tripe about once a week. I think you are making a great decision to feed raw. Best of luck with your new puppy.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thank you all for your replies!

Quossum: thank you for the answers!! I am very cautious over hole bones, I have seen vets having to remove large chunks of chicken carcase from a dogs throat that got lodged.
I know that so many do feed raw bones, but I am very worried about it.
I will deffo start with chicken, then turkey as its very similar, slowly working to different meats, and a piece of tripe once-twice a week.
I expect I will have a few hours travel to get my puppy, so If I make sure he hasnt eaten before his travel starts, I will give him his first raw meal once he has settled in his new home. Thank you again x


fjm: Yay!!! :D I have been looking at DAF too, I think that the berrywood is just muscle meat not whole, but I saw that DAF's includes everything, so if I wasnt comfortable feeding whole bones at least theres some going in this way :D
Would cooking it less and less over time, eventurally just going to raw help a mini who didnt want to eat raw mince? I was thinking of adding the sweet potato/pumpkin if the puppy's poo was a bit too soft on the mince alone as itl thicken it up, but not a large amount.
I am happy to keep doing teeth cleaning too
thank you soo much!x

CT girl:Thank you :D Its a relief to hear going streight onto it is safe and works well, I plan to follow that same pattern, chicken for a few weeks, then add in turkey every other meal then turkey for a few weeks if no problems and so on :) changing flavor after 10 packs (if 20 packs) or at the end of the 12 packs to change the meat.
I think instead of the minced tripe I will get tripe chunks, so I can feed one chunk a week or so rather then having to use a whole block of it up!
thank you again, I cant wait to get my pup and give him the best start I can x
 

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I think with Sophy it is more the texture than whether it is cooked or not - she likes raw meat in chunks, but not when it is gooey. Poppy just inhales everything! I do like the DAF as it is complete - no need to add eggshell etc - although I do add some more offal from time to time. I did have to oreder huge quantities though - their minimum order worked out at 60 450g packs, which takes up a lot of space! Fortunately my local kennels is now stocking it, and will order it in for me, so I can get just a few packs of each meat the dogs like. DAF also do mixed boxes, which can be a good way of ensuring variety.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Ahh I see, I hope my pup will get on ok with the minced up blocks, I would be happy feeding them to him, I dont mind ordering in large amounts, I am planning to get a big chest freezer just for dog food lol! I dont mind getting a few different types then and stocking up a lot!
What so you think of their new item 'gRAW'? Where its beef and chicken, a small amount of veg all sealed up in a roll? I am thinking if its any good alternating between that and the mince blocks, but im happy with the blocks :)

Do you add any multi vitamins at all? I am thinking of adding salmon oil, and the herbal mix 'billy no mates' from CSJ which repels flea's (I plan to have a bottle of water with a few drops of mint oil and lavender oil to spray lightly on the coat before walking him) as I much rather keep them at bay naturally!

would I be able to use a bag of kibble as treats rather then buying lots of not very well balanced treats? it would be much easier for clicker training and to carry around rather then chopped up meat ect.

Thank you again! x
 

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I looked at gRAW, and reckoned it was rather an expensive way of adding vegetables to meat! Mine enjoy kibble as treats - especially the small free sample bags of extra special stuff that I blag whenever I can! The also love liver or tuna cake/biscotti (recipes elsewhere on the forum).

If you have space for an extra freezer, you can take advantage of all sorts of bulk buys and supermarket special offers. I think I would read up on what constitutes a balanced diet (DogAware.com: Diet & Health Info for Man's Best Friend is a good source), then buy a just a few packs of one meat to start. A kilo or two of chicken mince - or even better, chicken with tripe - chicken wings, and an ice cube tray of steamed, pureed mixed vegetables would feed a pup for several weeks supplemented with a few sardine meals and a couple of scrambled egg meals. You can then introduce other proteins little by little.

I don't use multi vitamins - I decided long ago that the dangers of over supplementing were greater than the risks of insufficiency, in a well balanced diet. I do use PlaqueOff, which is for teeth but is kelp based, and I make salmon cakes from minced salmon and rice (another thin Sophy wouldn't eat until I'd made it into chunks!). I've heard good things about Billy no Mates, and the worm powder produced by he same company, but haven't had much problem with parasites on the dogs (the cats, on the other hand, get FrontLine Combo regularly, after one too many household infestations!).
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I thought it was a bit expensive, but wanted a 2nd opinion on it :) I am happy to do veggies in ice cube trays, thats a really good idea!
I was going to boil sweet potato, mash it up and make into balls, roll in egg or beef dripping and flour/oats and bake till set, but the ice cube tray is brilliant!
I have heard of liver cake, I will have to attempt making it lol! I like liver myself so I dont mind cooking some for me and some for the dog lol!

I am happy to get lots of things and freeze them, space wont be too much of an issue. Do you think instead of ordering from DAF right away, using the frozen mince from the pet shop for the first few weeks so I dont over buy till I know whats working for him? The sardines and eggs wont be a problem either.
I will study that site and make sure I get it right, I have quite some time to get it worked out :)

I agree there completely, I know how too much can be worse then too little, as this is as close to their natural diet as possible then it should contain everything they need. The salmon oil I want to add for a good coat ect, but I dont want to add too many chemicals into things.
Glad you heard CSJ are good! I know they are not expensive, but I know many dogs fed their stuff doing great, I will get one 15kilo sack of kibble from them and thats plenty of treats for a long long time! and get the herbs too!
I have seen the plac-off and the normal dog toothpaste, I will get both of them in advance so I have them both if needed.
same here, at my parents house our dogs rarely get flea's and when they do its just an odd few, where the cats bring them in all the time, and our old cat had a skin allergy to them making her bald and scabby, so the cats get frontline but the dogs dont. *springer spaniels, one in my avatar pic*

I have seen an antibacterial bar of soap for dogs *groomers online* and I already have a dog crate so I am thinking of feeding in the crate so the raw isnt dragged around the house, and wipe his paws and face with a warm sponge and the dog soap just to keep things clean, and anti-bacterial kitchen wipes to clean the bowl and inside the crate after meals.
I know that the thought of bacteria going everywhere puts most people off raw food, but doing those small steps will help (thanks to everyone I have seen doing this on here, such a simple solution!)
 

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I think it would be an excellent idea to try a few blocks of frozen food before buying in bulk - I would do the same with kibble for treats, and look at small bags (especially free sample bags), rather than huge ones. A few grams of kibble go a long way as treats (a mini poo probably needs less than 100g a day altogether as a full day's meals), so 15 kilos is likely to be very stale and long past it's use by date before your pup has eaten a fraction of it.

After trying many different tooth pastes and gels, I have coe to the conclusion that Logic gel (available from vets and online) is the most effective one that my dogs actually like! The other ones that worked had me digging them out from under the bed...
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Brilliant :) thank you! I will see if theres any trial bags going of kibble to gather near the time. I do see what you mean it will loose its smell and flavour and wont be as nice for him.
One of the websites I know of sells the logic one so I will give that one a go first :) my parents dogs get the wilkinsons minty dental sticks, which I might offer if needed, plus a nice thing to chew on whilst teething :)
 

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Discussion Starter #12
just back with a few more questions! oops!

I plan to add a herbal flea repellent to the diet, as well as a spray bottle of water with a few drops of lavender oil to help repel flea's and ticks, I dont like the 'on the back of the neck' flea drops at all.

Do you still need to worm a dog that is on a raw diet? especially as a puppy?

If you feed a dog 1 cup of kibble, would 1 cup of raw work out the same, or is it by weight only?

I am not comfortable feeding whole bones, I worry a lot as it is, the idea of raw bones that could scratch or puncture my dog on its way down is too much and I dont even have my dog yet!
as long as the bone is in the mince, and I make sure his teeth are ok, is that safe?
e.g if I break up a chicken wing and blend it, then add it to the normal mince, would that be better?

I am happy to add fish a few times a week once he is settled onto the main protein, as well as tripe and whole eggs.
I will add a small amount of veg (one small ice cube per meal, really small amount) including butternut squash, carrot and sweet potato, as they are quite beneficial to the dog.

I have looked at chicken necks, as they are fleshy on the outside, but the thought of the bones >.< i know so many of you do feed them, would it be safer to add 1/2 a chicken neck to a meal then a wing that is more 'spikey' bone shaped.

sorry for all the questions! >.<
 

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just back with a few more questions! oops!

I plan to add a herbal flea repellent to the diet, as well as a spray bottle of water with a few drops of lavender oil to help repel flea's and ticks, I dont like the 'on the back of the neck' flea drops at all.

Do you still need to worm a dog that is on a raw diet? especially as a puppy?

If you feed a dog 1 cup of kibble, would 1 cup of raw work out the same, or is it by weight only?

I am not comfortable feeding whole bones, I worry a lot as it is, the idea of raw bones that could scratch or puncture my dog on its way down is too much and I dont even have my dog yet!
as long as the bone is in the mince, and I make sure his teeth are ok, is that safe?
e.g if I break up a chicken wing and blend it, then add it to the normal mince, would that be better?

I am happy to add fish a few times a week once he is settled onto the main protein, as well as tripe and whole eggs.
I will add a small amount of veg (one small ice cube per meal, really small amount) including butternut squash, carrot and sweet potato, as they are quite beneficial to the dog.

I have looked at chicken necks, as they are fleshy on the outside, but the thought of the bones >.< i know so many of you do feed them, would it be safer to add 1/2 a chicken neck to a meal then a wing that is more 'spikey' bone shaped.

sorry for all the questions! >.<
Don't be sorry for questions, we want to help you. First please don't cut up the bones. That will make them more dangerous not less as it may enable the dog to gulp it down instead of chewing. You can grind the bone but that is a lot of work. Dogs are made to eat bones. My toy eats a whole chicken neck with no problems at least every other day. Not only is it good for his teeth but he is noticeably calmer. I prefer chicken necks to wings as they are a little less boney. You must do what you feel comfortable with though. I was nervous too about feeding raw bones. Swizzle just went to the vet today and she commented how great his teeth look.

To find out how much raw to feed take the dogs desired adult weight and feed about 3-4% of that. Swizzle is very active so I feed him more. I don't count bone in my calculation. See how this works for your dog and adjust accordingly.

A raw diet will not prevent worms. Swizzle has never had them but any dog can get them. One a year when Swizzle goes to the vet I bring a stool sample. If I noticed anything in between his yearly checkup I would go in. It is a good idea to check his poop. If it is too hard add more muscle meat, too soft more bone. If you see any critters time to bring a sample to the vet.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Thank you CT girl! I dont like to be a pain!! ^^'

I think I might be able to manage necks, I will just pretend they are sausages chunks instead, once I know he is eating the raw mince with no major upsets. I wont break up the bones now, I was just thinking of how to make them less... bony x.x
glad swizzle's teeth are nice and clean! :D

Ahh okies, so its completely weight and not volume then :) If the weight vary's a lot for a breed, then I can work with an aproximate adult weight, and up it/ lower it if i think he is getting too fat or too slender.
It just feels like im going to put down giant servings for a tiny puppy 3-4 times a day lol!

Ahh okies, so its less likely because of being a better diet, but it dosnt 'prevent' at all, dont worm for the sakes of it, just keep an eye on what comes out the other end ^^ if any signs (other then the normal for raw) of tummy trouble then de-worm and get a sample :)
Thank you again! x
 

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Ahh ok :) thank you Aubrey!
I could do the breeders recomended worming course till the puppy is a bit older and hardier, and then go to checking for signs, and worming if I see any, and get the vet to check over.
I will try and keep my pup away from things like fox poo ect, I will keep a very close eye when out in parks and woods, and make sure my garden is kept clean of any 'visitors' poo.
I have bookmarked the link for if my pup shows any signs, thank you :)
 

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The also love liver or tuna cake/biscotti (recipes elsewhere on the forum).
fjm, my dogs loved the liver cake I made from your recipe. I've just taken a pan of mackerel biscotti out of the oven this morning, and all indications are that it will be just as popular. The dogs send their thanks.
 
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