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I have a friend with a goldendoodle which has killed two sheep which got into their yard (they're next to a farm). He's also nearly killed a cat. It's all terror-aggression according to her; he's afraid of everything. I have never in all my days heard of a poodle tearing out the throat of livestock, so I'm guessing it's the retriever in him..?!
I've never heard of terror aggression describing prey drive. I am quite skeptical. I don't think that's correct for either breed. Most likely it's the result of a very poorly bred dog with a very poor temperament that doesn't match either breed standard.
 

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I've never heard of terror aggression describing prey drive. I am quite skeptical. I don't think that's correct for either breed. Most likely it's the result of a very poorly bred dog with a very poor temperament that doesn't match either breed standard.
My sister in law has a sheep herd. Believe me, the sight of ewes with their throats ripped out is not pretty. That dog is simply a killer. Once they get a taste for blood, they need to be put down because they cannot be trusted and will kill again at every opportunity

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For pete's sake, it is none of their business where you get anything. I used to have people ask if my whippets were rescues (hey, I like big; assume they thought they were greyhounds : ) ). I want healthy, therefore i go to a breeder. And adopt, don't shop...pfft. You are still CHOOSING which dog, hence "shopping". no?
 

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"adopt dont shop" doesn't make since either lmfao.

unless you blindly pick up a dog out of the shelter you are shopping too :p
 

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I too have felt shunned by some for buying a SPOO pup from a breeder. Those that know me well know that I have had (and still have 2) several rescues through my lifetime. Most have worked out fine. Had the most problems with a 3 year old Greyhound. First off, I wanted a non shedding puppy. I did not want a puppy that had already been spayed/neutered at 8 weeks old. I do feel bad sometimes that I am judged badly for my choice but I am happy with my SPOO.
 

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I have a friend with a goldendoodle which has killed two sheep which got into their yard (they're next to a farm). He's also nearly killed a cat. It's all terror-aggression according to her; he's afraid of everything. I have never in all my days heard of a poodle tearing out the throat of livestock, so I'm guessing it's the retriever in him..?!
Um. That is terrifying. I don't know this for sure, but I suspect many behaviour experts would recommend euthanasia for a dog like that. At the very least, he would have to be muzzled. What a sad existence he must have. His brain can't be right. :( Poodles were bred for retrieving, too. Retrieving instinct would have absolutely nothing to do with killing sheep.
 

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Ugh. I just have to get this off my chest: I am visiting my hometown this weekend, and over the last 2 days, I've seen 3 friends who have all sounded just so disappointed when I tell them we are planning to get our future dog from a breeder, as opposed to a shelter or rescue or pound. I have explained my reasoning to them, about wanting a puppy from health-tested parents from a responsible, ethical breeder, and how we are nervous about a rescue dog with an unknown background, largely because we have a baby under a year old at home, and live very rurally. We contacted and met with a Spoo breeder a few months ago, were impressed with her, her dogs, and her home where the pups are raised. A litter we are interested in was just born last week and will be ready to go home in January. (So I am very excited!!) Obviously adopting any dog is a huge responsibility and commitment, and going to a good breeder means there is a price tag to match, which we are willing to pay for a healthy dog from healthy parents who are treated well. But still my friends are like, "There are so many puppies and dogs who will be great family pets whom you can rescue," or "Three thousand dollars for a DOG? You're crazy!" Yes, I feel like I'm nuts for paying so much when there are so many free or cheap rescue dogs, BUT my gut tells me that now is not the time to rescue a dog with an unknown background. I should note that none of these friends have small children to worry about. And sure, if I didn't have children, my husband and I would absolutely want to adopt from a shelter. I researched shelter dogs for a couple months before we decided to go the breeder route -- every time we found a dog that looked like a good match, there was some issue: it was listed as not good with cats (we have a cat), or not good with kids, or not good with YOUNG kids, or couldn't be adopted out of state, or the rescue agency never got back to me, or the dog had already been adopted when I called! We live very rurally and the closest small city is 70 miles away, the closest major city is over 100 miles away. Not really conducive to looking at shelters to meet animals before we commit to taking a dog home. Anyway, I'm tired of always having to justify to my friends and family why we're going the breeder route as opposed to rescuing. Has anyone else had this experience too? Thanks for reading my rant.
I'm so sorry you're having to deal with being judged! It really isn't anyone's business. You need to get a dog that works best for your family! Especially since you have a small child. Getting a dog is a huge commitment and getting a rescue can be an even bigger one if they have a history of trauma. Plus when did it become a terrible thing to go to a responsible breeder?

My first two spoos were rescues and they had their fair share of baggage. My senior spoo passed away this summer and I've decided to go to a breeder for my next dog. My five year old rescue has a lot of emotional trauma that we are still working through even though we have had her for three years. Once my other spoo passed away a lot of her anxiety resurfaced. One of my friends was very judgmental about my decision to go to a breeder, even though she's never even had dogs herself and she constantly talks about how annoying her sister's rescued dog is because he has extreme anxiety. Most people just don't understand! But I absolutely get where you are coming from with feeling guarded and having to justify your decision, it's so annoying!
 

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Not sure how we got onto Goldens. However, for the last 10 years every single person I know who has had a Golden has lost them to cancer. Not sure if this is inbreeding, or what, but they are unfortunately gaining a reputation for being 'cancer dogs'. While alive they do seem to be very loving and lovable!
 

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Discussion Starter #69
Thank you to everyone for taking the time to share your thoughts. I really appreciate the support. Thank you for the links to articles and book references as well. This forum is excellent for furthering my education. I have "The Dog Merchants" book on order because of this thread.

News: We put down a deposit with a responsible breeder today in hopes of a pup from a litter set to go home in January 2021. One step closer!
 

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Thank you to everyone for taking the time to share your thoughts. I really appreciate the support. Thank you for the links to articles and book references as well. This forum is excellent for furthering my education. I have "The Dog Merchants" book on order because of this thread.

News: We put down a deposit with a responsible breeder today in hopes of a pup from a litter set to go home in January 2021. One step closer!
Awesome!

A note on Dog Merchants... while I found it an interesting book, I did not care for the author's conclusions. They seem to ascribe to the idea that dog breeds are superficial and breed differences are nothing more than cosmetic. I vehemently disagree with this. They seem to be peddling this idea in favor of adopt-don't-shop ideas. So... while I think it's a good read, I would still form your own ideas about things.
 

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Discussion Starter #71
Awesome!

A note on Dog Merchants... while I found it an interesting book, I did not care for the author's conclusions. They seem to ascribe to the idea that dog breeds are superficial and breed differences are nothing more than cosmetic. I vehemently disagree with this. They seem to be peddling this idea in favor of adopt-don't-shop ideas. So... while I think it's a good read, I would still form your own ideas about things.
Thanks for your thoughts! Sounds like this would be a good book to discuss in a book club.

Speaking of which, does PF ever have book club picks and discussions? I'd be up for that.
 

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Why not have the Dog Merchants as the first book since it does have some points of view in it that are clearly good jumping off points for conversation? Raindrops I agree with some of the points you mention regarding the Dog Merchants. It took a long time for me to read because I found so many perspectives that I agreed and then in another chapter decided I disagreed with. Then we also have a long list of various training books ranging from Ian Dunbar books to Cesar Milan and everywhere in between.
 

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Discussion Starter #76
Why not have the Dog Merchants as the first book since it does have some points of view in it that are clearly good jumping off points for conversation? Raindrops I agree with some of the points you mention regarding the Dog Merchants. It took a long time for me to read because I found so many perspectives that I agreed and then in another chapter decided I disagreed with. Then we also have a long list of various training books ranging from Ian Dunbar books to Cesar Milan and everywhere in between.
Sounds fantastic and Dog Merchants would be a great book to start with.

Where would we have our discussion? Make a separate thread, or do a conversation? I'm kind of new to the PF platform so will go along with whatever else people think is the best idea.
 

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Sounds fantastic and Dog Merchants would be a great book to start with.

Where would we have our discussion? Make a separate thread, or do a conversation? I'm kind of new to the PF platform so will go along with whatever else people think is the best idea.
I would think we could make a new thread in off topic chat and start a new thread for each new book. I will start a thread with an announcement post. I will include a date for starting the discussion so that people who want to join but haven't read that book can have a chance to do so.

 
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Love the idea of a book club. Maybe we could even do fiction occasionally? Love 'The Art of Racing in the Rain'.
I do have another book group and we do a monthly zoom meeting :)
 
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