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Discussion Starter #1
Hi. Please accept my apologies for any stupid question. I am trying to understand how having a puppy/dog works.

I know that differs from dog to dog and from puppy to puppy but please share your personal experience with your Poodle and the Day and Night potty routine (puppy and dog).

I live in an apartment. During the day it would be easier to take my puppy/dog outside. Plenty of parks around me, a lot of dogs for socializing as well. During the night, with still some day-light, before going to bed again we can go around to some parks.

What about when is dark outside? I don't feel very secure to go out when is dark, walking around with my dog/puppy. Feel a bit weird.

1. Do you think I can take my dog to potty in a spot in the toilet (having a potty pad)?
2. Can I train my dog to go to that spot in the toilet by himself once he grows up?

3a. I have a balcony, super safe, feels like a yard with flowers and grass but unfortunately, I cannot leave the door open during day or night. During the dark night, when is a puppy, I can take my puppy to potty outside in a spot in the balcony instead of going in a park or in the streets which feels a bit dangerous for me. Will this be ok for a puppy?
3b. But when my puppy grows up, will be ok to continue taking him out in the balcony during the dark night instead of going around in the middle of the night?

4. Until what age the puppy cannot hold urine? When the 'waking up during the night to potty' will stop?

Thanks:2in1:
 

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I would plan to take your puppy out on your balcony at night if the puppy is asking to go out. Take the baby out of the crate and carry out to the balcony. Make sure he goes (use a flashlight if needed) and then put him right back in the crate and go back to bed yourself. Keep that little trip all business, no talking other than a bit of praise for relieving himself and no playing. Carrying the pup will keep it about the potty and nothing else.


Most puppies/adolescent dogs gain the neuromuscular control to resist pressure of the bladder and bowel around 6-8 months of age. After you are sure that ability is there it shouldn't be necessary to make a night time potty trip.
 

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I would plan to take your puppy out on your balcony at night if the puppy is asking to go out. Take the baby out of the crate and carry out to the balcony. Make sure he goes (use a flashlight if needed) and then put him right back in the crate and go back to bed yourself. Keep that little trip all business, no talking other than a bit of praise for relieving himself and no playing. Carrying the pup will keep it about the potty and nothing else.


Most puppies/adolescent dogs gain the neuromuscular control to resist pressure of the bladder and bowel around 6-8 months of age. After you are sure that ability is there it shouldn't be necessary to make a night time potty trip.

So to understand, you are suggesting that going to the balcony with the puppy is fine until gets 6-8 months where he will be able to hold it for the night.

What about having a potty pad somewhere around the toilet area and training the puppy to go there during the night?
I am not sure how can someone can wake up every night for 6 months in a row so as to get the puppy to the toilet. Does anyone do that? Is it actually healthy for the human not having a proper sleep during the night for so long period?
 

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So to understand, you are suggesting that going to the balcony with the puppy is fine until gets 6-8 months where he will be able to hold it for the night.

What about having a potty pad somewhere around the toilet area and training the puppy to go there during the night?
I am not sure how can someone can wake up every night for 6 months in a row so as to get the puppy to the toilet. Does anyone do that? Is it actually healthy for the human not having a proper sleep during the night for so long period?
Yes, when you have a puppy you get up in the middle of the night, 1-2-3 times as long as necessary. It’s part of the deal and they need it.

Is your puppy a toy ? Is it a male ? You might find it very annoying to have a male lift his leg in your bathroom. And smelly. Males like to aim at walls, poles, ect. There are products you can buy to help buy it’s still a lot more convenient than taking him outside. And if not a toy, well the piddle will be a lot more than you might think.

What was your plan before acquiring the puppy ?
 

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Where is your puppy sleeping? With you? Or in a crate? My dogs for many years have been trained to go on wee pads, as well as outdoors.

How about putting a nice sized fake grass pad on the balcony. Take your puppy there last, right before you go to bed. Make sure every time he goes potty to be saying something like “go potty” or whatever works best for you.

When you take him to a dog park, walk him in a specific place and have him go potty before releasing him to play. This will teach him to go potty on demand. And continue to do this using the fake grass on the balcony too.

Make sure to give lots of praise and treats as soon as he is done. Not just at home but every time he goes potty.

In the middle of the night when he has to go, it should happen quickly once he’s learned. I asked where he sleeps because, if in a crate, he’ll whine or bark when he needs to go. And with my puppies they have all slept in the bed, but would wake me up when they had to go. Then a quick trip to the pad, about a minutes, they were ready to cuddle back up and go to sleep again. And when the puppy wakes you up, make sure to reward him.

In not too much time you’ll notice that you’re being waken up later and later in the night. Then next thing you know it’ll be all night.

So letting him go potty late at night isn’t a bid ordeal. Once he learns the basics, you’ll only be up for a very short time.

Hope this helped, and I wish you the best!


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Discussion Starter #6
Yes, when you have a puppy you get up in the middle of the night, 1-2-3 times as long as necessary. It’s part of the deal and they need it.

Is your puppy a toy ? Is it a male ? You might find it very annoying to have a male lift his leg in your bathroom. And smelly. Males like to aim at walls, poles, ect. There are products you can buy to help buy it’s still a lot more convenient than taking him outside. And if not a toy, well the piddle will be a lot more than you might think.

What was your plan before acquiring the puppy ?
Thanks for your answer.
I don't have a puppy. Not yet! I am trying to learn as much as possible before taking one. Having Male or Female is a question that I would like to answer at some point but I haven't yet. I am only considering to get a toy poodle.

But please be realistic. I read a lot of things online and the majority of the people seems to do an unhealthy lifestyle when they get a puppy forcing other people not to get one or stop living a normal life.

Assuming that you get a puppy when it becomes 8 weeks (2 months) until the puppy grows a bit and be able to hold it (as you said between 6-8 months) I have to expect that for about 6 months I will get up in the middle of the night between 1-3 times, every night? Does it sound very normal to you? Will I be as a human healthy enough to survive at work, with kids, live a normal life and be able to grow up my puppy offering him every day a lot of exercises, walks, etc?

The thing with the smelly is something that I am trying to figure out what people do when they live with a puppy and a dog. I cannot believe that people in the big cities have all villas, houses, and gardens. Most of the people are working full time and living in apartments. And I believe that a lot of people are willing to compromise a lot, as me, to offer love and welcome a new puppy in their family.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Where is your puppy sleeping? With you? Or in a crate? My dogs for many years have been trained to go on wee pads, as well as outdoors.

How about putting a nice sized fake grass pad on the balcony. Take your puppy there last, right before you go to bed. Make sure every time he goes potty to be saying something like “go potty” or whatever works best for you.

When you take him to a dog park, walk him in a specific place and have him go potty before releasing him to play. This will teach him to go potty on demand. And continue to do this using the fake grass on the balcony too.

Make sure to give lots of praise and treats as soon as he is done. Not just at home but every time he goes potty.

In the middle of the night when he has to go, it should happen quickly once he’s learned. I asked where he sleeps because, if in a crate, he’ll whine or bark when he needs to go. And with my puppies they have all slept in the bed, but would wake me up when they had to go. Then a quick trip to the pad, about a minutes, they were ready to cuddle back up and go to sleep again. And when the puppy wakes you up, make sure to reward him.

In not too much time you’ll notice that you’re being waken up later and later in the night. Then next thing you know it’ll be all night.

So letting him go potty late at night isn’t a bid ordeal. Once he learns the basics, you’ll only be up for a very short time.

Hope this helped, and I wish you the best!


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Thanks for your answer. Very helpful.

I don't have a puppy. Not yet :) I am planning to get a toy poodle once I answer my questions and feel ready basically.

I am thinking to have a small crate in the living room/kitchen (live in flat, open space) and training my puppy sleeping in the crate. Or staying there when I am at work/ have things to do and not be able to supervise it.

The fake grass pad on the balcony is one of the best options that I actually want to do. I saw a couple of different options available online. Please let me know if you recommend a specific one :)

I saw a lot of videos about treats and giving a lot of praise. That seems to be working a lot. I am planning as well to do that. So, based on your experience, a puppy (and later when it grows up) will never learn to go by itself for potty. It will need always someone next to it, right?
 

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So to understand, you are suggesting that going to the balcony with the puppy is fine until gets 6-8 months where he will be able to hold it for the night. YES

What about having a potty pad somewhere around the toilet area and training the puppy to go there during the night? THAT IS FINE TOO
I am not sure how can someone can wake up every night for 6 months in a row so as to get the puppy to the toilet. Does anyone do that? YES Is it actually healthy for the human not having a proper sleep during the night for so long period? WELL THAT IS JUST TOO BAD. IT IS SOMETHING THAT YOU COMMIT TO WHEN YOU COMMIT TO A PUPPY OR TO A HUMAN CHILD.

I don't mean to come off as mean spirited about the work of properly raising a puppy, but it is not easy to do a good job turning a blank slate of a puppy into a decent adult dog. If you want a dog who is reliably housebroken, has nice manners and will be a pleasure to live with to be your companion for 12-17 years then a few months of self sacrifice will be well worth it. You may find it helpful to read the linked thread. https://www.poodleforum.com/5-poodle-talk/182666-puppy-reality.html
 

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I agree with lily cd re - if getting up multiple times during the night is a no-go for you (understandable), then don't get a puppy. If you still do want a dog, you could adopt an adult dog that is already housetrained and able to sleep through the night without needing a trip to the bathroom.
 

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I don't mean to come off as mean spirited about the work of properly raising a puppy, but it is not easy to do a good job turning a blank slate of a puppy into a decent adult dog. If you want a dog who is reliably housebroken, has nice manners and will be a pleasure to live with to be your companion for 12-17 years then a few months of self sacrifice will be well worth it. You may find it helpful to read the linked thread. https://www.poodleforum.com/5-poodle-talk/182666-puppy-reality.html
Maybe I was not clear. You make it sounds like I don't want to commit or I am not willing for a few months of self-sacrificing which is clearly not true!

Correct me if I am wrong but I understand that you say from the time that the puppy gets 2 months until (maximum) 8 months, which means 6 months, therefore more than 180 nights in a row, a human who wants to raise a puppy needs to set an alarm every 2-3 hours during night so as to take the puppy for potty. Is what you said or I got it wrong?

I understand that you might sometimes stay awake during the whole night because your puppy might need you but generally speaking having that lifestyle for 6 months doesn't sound right. Are you exaggerate a bit? I am quite worried about all these people with puppies now. Hope that they manage to survive without being a zombie. Unless they don't work during the day and they sleep while the puppy is sleeping.

Thanks for the link I will have a look :)
 

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I agree with lily cd re - if getting up multiple times during the night is a no-go for you (understandable), then don't get a puppy. If you still do want a dog, you could adopt an adult dog that is already housetrained and able to sleep through the night without needing a trip to the bathroom.
Thanks for your reply. Was the same case for you? For 6 months you were waking up every night (180 in a row) 1-2-3 times to take your puppy around the streets for potty or outside in your yard?
 

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Thanks for your answer. Very helpful.



I don't have a puppy. Not yet :) I am planning to get a toy poodle once I answer my questions and feel ready basically.



I am thinking to have a small crate in the living room/kitchen (live in flat, open space) and training my puppy sleeping in the crate. Or staying there when I am at work/ have things to do and not be able to supervise it.



The fake grass pad on the balcony is one of the best options that I actually want to do. I saw a couple of different options available online. Please let me know if you recommend a specific one :)



I saw a lot of videos about treats and giving a lot of praise. That seems to be working a lot. I am planning as well to do that. So, based on your experience, a puppy (and later when it grows up) will never learn to go by itself for potty. It will need always someone next to it, right?


Can you keep a crate in your bedroom when you are sleeping? The first night it two, it will cry for attention, but he or she will calm down if you simply place your hand on the crate and quietly talk to him, he will fall back to sleep. But when he does cry take him out to the pad. Probably not in the first little while of him getting in his crate, but when he wakes you. If you try and calm him down and it doesn’t work then take him out to the pad, and when done right back in the crate.

The pad I use, which is a nice size for a toy, comes in 3 parts. The bottom is a tray to catch the urine. Stray to keep the pad off the flat surface so it can drain, and the pad itself. You can get them in other sizes, smaller or larger. But you can see it here...

https://www.amazon.com/Giantex-Training-Surface-Portable-Bathroom/dp/B07RB9N4KN/ref=mp_s_a_1_11?keywords=dog+grass+pad&qid=1566497275&s=gateway&sr=8-11&th=1&psc=1

It is very possible to raise a puppy into a well mannered dog. I raised a chihuahua, who grew only to 4.8 pounds. I used wee wee pads at that time. He slept on the bed with me and woke me up in the middle of the night to pee. He was insistent I get up. I had put a wee pad on my floor near the end of the bed, but where I could see it. The first week I would get up, put him in the pad, then pick him up and get back in bed. He would only wake me once a (7 hour) night.

After that week, I’d simply put him on the floor, he’d go right to the pad and come back for me to pick him up. He stopped going in the middle of the night shortly after that. I went to bed around 12am, and took up his water at 10pm. He was never truly thirst when he woke up. Once he started holding it all night I’d started just leaving the water down.

Please don’t feel like it’s impossible. Of all I’ve read here, I just have never had so much trouble raising a very nice, well behaved puppy that is super enjoyable.


I would also suggest a playpen during the day, or a baby gate on the kitchen door where he can play and sleep, eat and drink while you are gone. I don’t think it’s right to crate day and night with only a short while out with the family. You can leave a wee pad on the floor and let him pee on that during the day.



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Maybe I was not clear. You make it sounds like I don't want to commit or I am not willing for a few months of self-sacrificing which is clearly not true! I understood you quite clearly.

Correct me if I am wrong but I understand that you say from the time that the puppy gets 2 months until (maximum) 8 months, which means 6 months, therefore more than 180 nights in a row, a human who wants to raise a puppy needs to set an alarm every 2-3 hours during night so as to take the puppy for potty. Is what you said or I got it wrong? No that isn't quite it. You need to respond to the needs of the puppy. These needs will change over time. It might be 2 or 3 times a night and then not at all then 1 or 2 times. Don't set an alarm let the pup tell you what they need. They will wake up and may whimper or act unsettled. That is their way of telling you it is potty time. Don't ignore that ask for relief so as to allow mistakes in the crate.

I understand that you might sometimes stay awake during the whole night because your puppy might need you but generally speaking having that lifestyle for 6 months doesn't sound right. Are you exaggerate a bit? Yes I think you are overthinking this. It is just like giving birth to and caring for your newborn child. You may feel like a zombie for a while, but we are adaptable and can do what we need to for those who depend on us. I am quite worried about all these people with puppies now. Hope that they manage to survive without being a zombie. Unless they don't work during the day and they sleep while the puppy is sleeping.

Thanks for the link I will have a look :)

Agreeing with jojogal that I think the best place for a crate for the first few months is near your bed so you will here the puppy stir, be able to go out for the quick potty stop and get everybody back to bed in five minutes or less. I am a poor sleeper and get of a couple of times a night. It is what I have adapted to and I function just fine.
 
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I have a 5.5 month old puppy and he can now generally make it through the night but I go to sleep very late or let him out very early so it's probably never much longer than 6 hours. I have had him since he was 10 weeks, and for a long time I was getting up at 2-3 to take him out. I would usually fall asleep with him on the couch, then wake up at 2 or 3 and take him out to potty, then put him in crate and then go to sleep in my bed. It is only recently that he can really hold it. I keep him in a pen with a potty that has a pee pad holder, but he only rarely uses it because he knows to go outside now. For the first month I had him, potty training was extremely difficult and seemed nearly hopeless. But finally he gradually had fewer accidents. I still do not trust him not to pee on soft things like towels though. There has only been one night where I really have barely slept, but that was because he kept waking me up because he had diarrhea and needed to go out constantly.

Is it healthy? Probably not. I have not had very many proper nights of sleep in the last three months. But you make a sacrifice to be able to raise your dog the way you want. It is similar to how new parents barely get any sleep. You also have a baby animal and it will require a lot of time and commitment. Puppies are cute, but they have needle sharp teeth and they pee, poop, and vomit a lot. It is a lot like having a toddler.

I would consider what your daily routine is like to see whether you will need to hire additional help for the first couple months. I work in academia, so I was able to get my pup early in the summer and then I had three full months where I was very flexible and never had to be gone more than a few hours. If I worked full time, I would have scheduled as much vacation time as possible when the puppy came home, and then hired somebody to come by each day when I had to work.
 

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I think you need to see a puppy as a baby dog. Similar to baby humans. «*Healthy*» has nothing to do in this equation. Would you ask yourself if it’s healthy for you to feed your human baby every two hours, even in the middle of the night ? Of course not !

Same thing applies for a baby dog. They have a tiny bladder and they need to pee. Either you let them pee in their crate, and they certainly won’t be housebroken, or you take them out.

Realistically, I would say an 8-10 week old puppy needs to go at 11 pm, 2 am and 5 am. Slowly this will decrease to 11 pm, 3 am and 5 or 6 am. Then one day, only once around 3 am and wake up time at 6 or 7 am. That’s realistically what would need to happen. Or something similar.

Just from reading the way you think, I believe an adult would be much easier for you, and better suited to your life. It could be a young adult, 10-12 months old, and already housebroken.

If you want your dog to go on a pipi pad, choose a female. Much easier, as they don’t lift their leg.

One last thing, toy breeds are harder to housebreak than other breeds. They take time and patience, sometimes more than a year. One more reason to get an adult that’s already housebroken if you don’t want your sleep to be interrupted.

On the other hand, if you don’t care if your dog goes outside, then setting your puppy up for the night in an x-pen with a pipi pad in a potty area would mean you don’t need to get up.
 

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Thanks for your reply. Was the same case for you? For 6 months you were waking up every night (180 in a row) 1-2-3 times to take your puppy around the streets for potty or outside in your yard?
I have not experienced this yet - for the last 20 years or so, I have had adopted adult dogs. I have had to housetrain those dogs, but they were not puppies, so waking during the night was not necessary.

My relationship with these dogs has been very rewarding, and has led me to desire another dog. But I have also had some behavioral problems with adopted dogs, and that has led me to decide that I want my next dog to be a puppy from a good breeder, so I can make sure I am starting with a dog that has been raised under good conditions, to have a healthy, well-adjusted adult.

The poodle puppy I am getting is almost 8 weeks old now, and I expect to bring her home next week. Ask me again in a couple of weeks how it's going :) I will answer if I'm not too sleepy lol.
 

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I think you need to see a puppy as a baby dog. Similar to baby humans. «*Healthy*» has nothing to do in this equation. Would you ask yourself if it’s healthy for you to feed your human baby every two hours, even in the middle of the night ? Of course not !

Same thing applies for a baby dog. They have a tiny bladder and they need to pee. Either you let them pee in their crate, and they certainly won’t be housebroken, or you take them out.

Realistically, I would say an 8-10 week old puppy needs to go at 11 pm, 2 am and 5 am. Slowly this will decrease to 11 pm, 3 am and 5 or 6 am. Then one day, only once around 3 am and wake up time at 6 or 7 am. That’s realistically what would need to happen. Or something similar.

Just from reading the way you think, I believe an adult would be much easier for you, and better suited to your life. It could be a young adult, 10-12 months old, and already housebroken.

If you want your dog to go on a pipi pad, choose a female. Much easier, as they don’t lift their leg.

One last thing, toy breeds are harder to housebreak than other breeds. They take time and patience, sometimes more than a year. One more reason to get an adult that’s already housebroken if you don’t want your sleep to be interrupted.

On the other hand, if you don’t care if your dog goes outside, then setting your puppy up for the night in an x-pen with a pipi pad in a potty area would mean you don’t need to get up.

Please let's not compare different things. Kids are kids and dogs are dogs. Different but both needs a lot of compromises, love. Dogs learn by having a routine. Kids are not like that. We see around on the internet having some facts about dogs that no one can say are not exist. There are some kids who might never wake up for food during the night but no-one says that dogs when they are 10 weeks old, sleep the whole night without waking up. Everyone says that puppies cannot hold the entire night, need to go for potty every 2-3 hours. Fact and we accept that.

You also comparing two different actions: feeding and taking for a potty (because the puppy cannot go alone and we might have an accident around the flat, or anywhere else). The one is about food, the other one is about going to the toilet.

The thread started with my concerns about going outside during the night in a big city, dark night with my dog. Something that I cannot do because it is quite scared so late for me. So I asked for alternatives especially at the beginning where the puppy cannot hold, and during the night where it needs to go for potty every 2-3. Then, someone said that it can take actually 6 months of waking-up every night 2-3 hours. 6 months are a lot. That's where the " healthy " lifestyle comes. I haven't said that I am not willing to wake up for my puppy or interrupt my sleep. Don't assume things about me that I actually didn't say :)

Thanks for the advice about the pipi pad. Unfortunately, my dog cannot go outside alone. The door for the balcony and yard needs to be open by a human, all windows. Before assuming anything, I live in a flat with a balcony. Super transformed into a yard/garden with flowers and grass. SUPER SAFE FOR THE DOG. :)
 

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I have not experienced this yet - for the last 20 years or so, I have had adopted adult dogs. I have had to housetrain those dogs, but they were not puppies, so waking during the night was not necessary.

My relationship with these dogs has been very rewarding, and has led me to desire another dog. But I have also had some behavioral problems with adopted dogs, and that has led me to decide that I want my next dog to be a puppy from a good breeder, so I can make sure I am starting with a dog that has been raised under good conditions, to have a healthy, well-adjusted adult.

The poodle puppy I am getting is almost 8 weeks old now, and I expect to bring her home next week. Ask me again in a couple of weeks how it's going :) I will answer if I'm not too sleepy lol.
That's so nice. I will ask you then. We can stay in touch. :) Good Luck. Have you decided a name for her?
 

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No, we haven't chosen a name yet, but we have a list of possibilities. We will wait until she comes home, and then maybe she will tell us in some way what her name should be.
 
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