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Copying this link from a thread a few months ago about doodle breeding, focus on breeders doing health testing and trying to "set" a breed standard.

In doing the vetting for breeders to be added to The List, it's not unusual to see "Hybrid" as a breed designation.

and just found this, which may touch a bit on the above link, and may also explain additional variations in looks and temperament of labradoodles. I haven't done any follow up on this one yet.
 

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"one definite way to tell a purebred poodle is what I call the "poodle strut." They walk like they are almost floating on air, there's no other breed that has the purebred poodle strut. " That's actually written into the standard. The poodle standard says: Gait: A straightforward trot with light springy action and strong hindquarters drive. Head and tail carried up.

It's that springy action that really defines poodle movement.
Lol!! Maybe they'll add my "poodle strut" description to the standard...copyright of course, haha!
 

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That's what I thought labradoodles looked like. Weird that all my google searches turn up the same fluffy dogs I think of as goldendoodles.

I actually like that wispy, wiry hair. I think it's really cute. But if I wanted a wiry breed, I'd get a German Wirehaired Pointer like my childhood dog. She was so funny and clever, and such a lovely size.
Weirdly a lot do look like this. Very few I encounter have a fleecey coat. Labradoodles with this coat can actually be hand stripped aswell like wire coats. I once groomed a smooth coated one that was like a skinny Labrador as it had the built of a poodle.
 

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I agree that structure and gait are more indicative of poodle purity than coat texture. My girl is pure standard and does not have correct coat texture on her hips and tail, but sure has all of the poodle attitude and “strut”! I actually posted a question to this group when she was much younger asking why her her tail was so floppy and would it improve. I couldn’t understand why I could not create the poms. I was correctly informed, much to my dismay, that by her age it would not change. I had to shave it last fall due to a severe allergic reaction and I like the way it looks with a just few months of growth much better and plan to keep it this way. It finally looks a bit fluffy instead of droopy with e shorter length😉
 

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I love the comparison to ballerinas and gazelles :) After that I next look at the narrowness and length of muzzle. Other things then just sort of flash by like narrowness of rib cage, from the side the depth of chest sliding up to the skinny waist. Others have mentioned the rest.

I've only been fooled 3 times by an adult standard size dog. (Puppies are harder to tell.) One was by a very fat poodle, 2nd one had me puzzled as they said 100% poodle and it made me wonder if they had been lied to or given false papers, but there was one goldendoodle that fooled me.

I have discovered that doodles can look like just about anything. Realize that no top poodle breeders will allow one of their dogs to be bred to anything other than another well bred poodle. So any doodle will have come from a substandard poodle to begin with. If anyone finds a really good poodle breeder (who has dogs that have won confirmation ribbons from the best shows and become an American Kennel Club “Champion of Record” ) that will allow their magnificent poodle to be bred with some other breed, or even a substandard poodle, then I will gladly eat my words. I will even pay you $100 :)
 

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Both Goldendoodles and Labradoodles are really popular where I'm from. Since they are a crossbreed, I think it highly depends on the amount of genetics a dog has that depicts what they look like. There are various generations of Goldendoodle that either give them a flat, wavvy, or curly coat. I think there are three aspects why people really like these dogs: they look like a teddy bear, get some nonshedding features, and are partially hypoallergenic.
I think the reasons that doodles first came around is because they wanted a hypoallergenic guide dog that has an outstanding temperament. I think they are good dog breeds and have nothing against them.
 

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I used to feel the same way until I got a poodle...

I haven’t been around too many multi-gen Australian labradoodles, but the doodles I’ve met have a wide range of temperaments and looks regardless of whether they were F1, F1b, F2, or a “double doodle”. In general, the goldendoodles seem to be a bit more easygoing, but I don’t know if that’s actually a thing or just my experience.

My old boss thought I was crazy for getting a poodle since he had labs his whole life and he described his labradoodle as neurotic. He believed that the neuroticism had to come from the poodle side since labs weren’t that way.. I’m glad that I could eventually convince him otherwise by introducing him to my poodle.

I don’t take issue with the dogs themselves, it’s more the irresponsible breeding practices that are somewhat common... I’ve seen people charging $5000 for puppies without health tested parents. It also seems as though the only traits that matter are size and color, neither of which should be a priority when establishing a new breed in my opinion. Then there’s the lack of education on the part of some breeders when it comes to the maintenance of the dog’s hair. Lots of groomers in my area dread doodles because they’re usually matted and the owners get upset when they shave them down.

Again, that’s not to say that all doodle breeders and doodles are this way.. I know several doodles that have great dispositions and are very well taken care of, but it’s definitely a trend you see whenever a breed becomes popular.

As far as the differences between poodles and doodles, I usually go by the strut as well. Seems like I’m not the only one... People usually think Snoop is a goldendoodle because of her puppy coat and undocked tail, but the poodle demeanor is a dead giveaway.
 

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......
I think the reasons that doodles first came around is because they wanted a hypoallergenic guide dog that has an outstanding temperament. I think they are good dog breeds and have nothing against them.
I do apologize, but this displays lack of knowledge about breeding. Sorry. Doodles are basically 'mutts'. They are not a dog breed, although many of the 'doodlebreeders' claim otherwise, and charge an arm and a leg for these popular designer dogs. I am continuously astounded that anyone would pay even close to what a well bred poodle costs for them. You are free to be as insulted as you want.

I have an amazing Standard Poodle, Service Dog,from a top breeder, who has more than an outstanding temperament. The original breeder of doodles has apologized time and again and said he wished he had never done it.

I finally gave in and got a standard poodle because of allergies, even though I thought at the time they were 'frou-frou' dogs. I have had horrible reactions to some doodles, as well as labs and goldens, etc. I am find with my Spoo, as long as he does not play contact type play with other dogs and get their dander, hair, etc all over him, I am fine. Otherwise I have to bathe him afterwards to able to be with him, so avoid them. I will never have any other breed.

Yep. I know a family that paid $6,000 for theirs. Eeeeeesh.

And I also find that doodle owners tend to blame the poodle part for all their dog's neuroses. Sad that they blame the breed and not the breeder.
Totally agree, as no well bred poodle breeder would allow their poodle to be cross bred. (See above where I offer $100) So it has to be from an inferiorly bred poodle.

I so wish we could actually bring in that original doodle owner into the discussion.
 

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I do think that they could eventually be an established breed. All breeds were essentially mutts at one point, but it takes mindful breeding to achieve this.

I think that’s what the people breeding Australian Labradoodles are trying to achieve (they also introduced other breeds like cocker spaniel and Irish water spaniel into the mix) but who knows how regulated the term really is.. From what I understand, these puppies are more likely to have predictable looks and temperaments since they have much longer breeding lines.
 

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I do think that they could eventually be an established breed. All breeds were essentially mutts at one point, but it takes mindful breeding to achieve this.
How will they be able to do this? Each mix would have to be from an established lineage on both sides. Quite a puzzling feat. Especially if top breeders of each breed will not allow their best dogs to be cross bred?
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A Designer Dog-Maker Regrets His Creation
The inventor of the Labradoodle believes he created a Frankenstein.


Posted Apr 01, 2014
 

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I also think that they can become an actual breed, through selective breeding. They will be like the Barbet they have multiple coat type possibilities and it is very difficult to predict what type of coat they will have. Some people have to get down off their high thrones also if that were to happen.
 

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I can't help wondering if one reason that doodles are popular locally is that they're more likely to be available than purebred dogs. We all know that finding a good health tested poodle pup can be a challenge.

I've seen and met several standards here in Knoxville since we got Normie, but I haven't seen a single mini.

So it's not surprising that strangers ask if he's a doodle. His 'retriever' cut makes him look even more doodlish.
 

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How will they be able to do this? Each mix would have to be from an established lineage on both sides. Quite a puzzling feat. Especially if top breeders of each breed will not allow their best dogs to be cross bred?
Probably they would have to establish a standard first, then iron out any rough bits in the breed through selective breeding, just as you would with a normal breed. The mat-happy coat would need to go. As would any unstable temperament. Any other negatives about the breed, too, I guess 😅.

Mating a dog without one health issue to one that does, but lacks another issue that the original one does have, then selecting the puppies that don’t have any seems like the most likely option for labradoodles, since it’s unlikely that breeders would be able to get ahold of good breeding stock. This would produce dogs with bad health in the beginning (which is heartbreaking, tbh) but in the long run, it would even out to create the dogs that everyone seems to want, but in good health, and therefore, less health problems overall for more dogs! I think that’s similar to what they’re doing with Dobies and their heart issues right now, if I’m not mistaken. It’s also possible that they could find some base dogs with major ‘faults’ that are pretty much cosmetic (too long, a little short, etc.), then breed from there. It’s unlikely to find a dog like that without bad health, but still possible. Imports from other countries that are a bit more relaxed on spay/neuter might work, too. If the top dog registries would accept the breed, maybe some better breeders would be willing to pitch in? Doubt that would happen, though.

I sincerely hope and do think that the labradoodle does become an actual breed, however, maybe a couple decades into the future. Maybe then we would stop seeing so many poorly bred, overpriced dogs, and there would be an actual standard, so people would know what an actual labradoodle (and poodle!) looks like. I’m sure it also would mean the world to folks who need it for its original purpose.
 

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Just caught this thread and wanted to ask ... does anyone else distinguish doodles by their noses? Not the muzzle, just the nose itself, which is sometimes all you can see poking out from the long coat. Poodle noses are slim and well contained, but doodle noses are huge, like PWD noses, even if they have slender muzzles. It has been my shortcut to deciding what to call a dog when you don't get to see its movement.
 

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I guess I can see them one day becoming a "breed". But I think its will be challenging. Perhaps the Australian labradoodle will have a chance at it. The golden doodle,w ell it seems everyone is breeding them now , because of the big dollars they get for them. My neighAnd I constantly hear how poodle hers is and how he has poodle fur. Duh he has wavy fur with the texture of a retriever that can actually be easily combed while my poodle has tight curls which I need to comb out about once a week if I want him to look fluffy but really I like his curls especially if I have him short. What I don't understand is why the get so much $$$ for them. Her daughter recently purchased one from th is breeder.
Not sure what the mix is she has but I can say that he is gorgeous, even tempered and she has 5 children from 12- 18 months and the dog is good with all of them. The paid well over $3000 for him.
look at the price for this one Teddybear Goldendoodles
 

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.. does anyone else distinguish doodles by their noses? Not the muzzle, just the nose itself, which is sometimes all you can see poking out from the long coat. Poodle noses are slim and well contained, but doodle noses are huge, like PWD noses, even if they have slender muzzles. It has been my shortcut to deciding what to call a dog when you don't get to see its movement.
Yes, but every once in awhile the doodles have smaller ones if they have enough poodle.
 

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I know someone (edit: who does not live in North America) who has an Australian Labradoodle. Now that I understand what that term actually means, I can absolutely see them someday becoming their own officially recognized breed. They are nicely proportioned and very much have their own distinct look, like a sturdy spaniel.

Very unlike the ones I see around here.
 
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