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From those of you who have experience in the AKC show ring, what is your opinion on the competitiveness of Standard Poodles versus the Boxer ring? I know both breeds utilize Professional handlers, but what's your opinion? Hubby really loves Boxers. I love Boxers, but I think I love Spoos more.......
 

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From those of you who have experience in the AKC show ring, what is your opinion on the competitiveness of Standard Poodles versus the Boxer ring? I know both breeds utilize Professional handlers, but what's your opinion? Hubby really loves Boxers. I love Boxers, but I think I love Spoos more.......
How do you mean?? I think a Boxer win is a lot more in the realm of reality, because what you see is what you get. There is nothing there to cover up flaws with. A Poodle is a work of art, and you can certainly hide a lot with their coat. Is this what you meant??
 

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Sort of, I kow the boxer grooming is WAY WAY WAY easier than poodle. Before I got into showing we were thinking of a Boxer to begin with and I was told by several people that I shouldn't start with a Boxer as a first conformation show dog because they're so political, so many pro handlers are used that coming in as a newbie I'd have very little chance of finishing one. So comparing a the boxer ring with the poodle ring and suppose you had equally correct dogs to start with, which ring will put up a newbie to the breed first? Am I making any sense?
 

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I don't think there'd be any difference. The show world pretty much uses pro handlers now, and bred by dogs are likely not going to have too much of a chance. It is political no matter what breed you are showing. So I don't think there is much if any difference at all.
 

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They are probably similar to Dobermans. Dobies are a very pro handler breed at least here in the US they are. I think any breed that needs a lot of strict training and muscle mass is going to be a pro handler breed. I read a great article written by an owner handler of a doberman and he said you can go out there and compete with the pros but you and your dog had better be ready and with a breed that doesn't have hair to hide flaws, your dog had better look in specatular shape so it's a lot of commitment to exercise and training with those working breeds. With a poodle you expect them to be little clowny and funny and prancing around the ring. With a boxer, you expect them to be completely focused, very well muscled, and obedient to what you want it to do.
 

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I guess I go to different show than all of you . I see lots of owner handles winning in all breeds and even at westmister there were owner handlers in the ring..You do not have to be a prfessional to win. End of story.. You need to have a nice dog impeccibly goomed and present in a professional manner Look up George Alton He puts on a GRET handling class.. He is well worth the money.. He teaches owners how to become professionals I took his class 4 times... I love boxers.... BTW
 

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I guess I go to different show than all of you . I see lots of owner handles winning in all breeds and even at westmister there were owner handlers in the ring..You do not have to be a prfessional to win. End of story.. You need to have a nice dog impeccibly goomed and present in a professional manner Look up George Alton He puts on a GRET handling class.. He is well worth the money.. He teaches owners how to become professionals I took his class 4 times... I love boxers.... BTW
I'm pretty sure that's what I said, owner handlers can win but to compete with pros you had better present yourself like one. Have your dog in impeccable shape and make sure that the handling is flawless. Of course if you are picking up 1 pointers and not majors in a breed like boxers or dobies then you might not have to be so strict on yourself but at some point you are going to have to go up against a bunch of pros to get those majors so you had better do your reading, watching, training, and practice to be prepared.
 

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Hey, BRP, I googled George Alston and went to the AKC site where they have a list of all the seminars that are going on. Found he has a 2-day seminar coming up March 6 in Southern Pines, NC; another one March 13 in Salisbury, MD (doesn't say 2-day so may be only a day); and a 2-day seminar March 27 in St. Louis. I've checked out his book from the library before and would definitely like to go to his seminar. You can even attend without a dog just to audit (for some of us who have not yet gotten a poodle). By the way, there's a Poodle Seminar (Miniature) on March 17 in Independence, MO.

There are hundreds (may be exaggerating by 30 or so!) of seminars on every imaginable breed and dog concern from breeding, to training for conformation, obedience, rally, tracking, ...Thanks, BRP, for mentioning his seminar. Now I have a great site to look up seminars.
 

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He is the best I read his book before every show just to tone up.. You will not be sorry . I know that you will learn every time that you go but it is best the second time around to take a dog .. The more you can learn the better off you will be .. Sign up !
The stars is going and I think it might be this very same one in March .. PM her and ask how fun would that be :)
 

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I guess I go to different show than all of you . I see lots of owner handles winning in all breeds and even at westmister there were owner handlers in the ring..You do not have to be a prfessional to win. End of story.. You need to have a nice dog impeccibly goomed and present in a professional manner Look up George Alton He puts on a GRET handling class.. He is well worth the money.. He teaches owners how to become professionals I took his class 4 times... I love boxers.... BTW
But you must believe too that if Kaz walks into a ring with a dog on the end of a leash, a breeder/owner/handler or owner/handler better have a dog bordering on PERFECTION to even get a second glance from the judge! And even then it might not have a hope in you know where.
 

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Why not ? You gotta start somewhere you cant just naysay all the time .. If you never get out there and try you certainly cannot win and you will never learn.. Handling classes and fun Matches.. Just do it !
 

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Some breeds are more political than others - It would be much easier for me to finish one of my Italian Greyhounds than my Whippet (I have shown both in the breed ring and have shown a couple other breeds for other folks).

I would guess that Kaz would NOT walk into the ring with a dog that wasn't top quality :biggrin:
 

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Some breeds are more political than others - It would be much easier for me to finish one of my Italian Greyhounds than my Whippet (I have shown both in the breed ring and have shown a couple other breeds for other folks).

I would guess that Kaz would NOT walk into the ring with a dog that wasn't top quality :biggrin:
I am sure you are right, but you know what I mean. The judges are used to him coming in with quality dogs, so even if he DID come in with a poor quality dog, he would likely be put up because he is Kaz. Same with a lot of handlers.

Iris' breeders goes to the shows and barely talks to any of the other Whippet people because of what gooes on. She said if she got involved in the crap that goes on, she would never show again because it is vicious. And keeping her nose out of the "stuff" she quietly turns her girl into the top winning Whippet in Canada in 2008. Love it. More fuel for their fire!!
 

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I am sure you are right, but youy know what I mean. The judges are used to him coming in with quality dogs, so even if he DID come in with a poor quality dog, he would likely be put up because he is Kaz. Same with a lot of handlers.

Iris' breeders goes to the shows and barely talks to any of the other Whippet people because of what gooes on. She said if she got involved in the crap that goes on, she would never show again because it is vicious. And keeping her nose out of the "stuff" she quietly turns her girl into the top winning Whippet in Canada in 2008. Love it. More fuel for their fire!!
I know exactly what you mean - there is so much political stuff that goes on at breed shows - it's unreal. My BIL is a professional handler and it's crazy the stuff that people say and do. I'll stick to performance events :biggrin:
 

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I talked with all the other exibitors at the show that was the fun part . Looking at the dogs asking questions and sharing in each other wins and losses. Crying for each other when we lost a dog .. I cannot imagine having to be like that ..How awful ! I have found the poodle people to be quite kind....Everywhere..... I have been to the Las Vegas Specialty the Phoenix Specialty and several other all breed shows and all was positive ...I guess the world is what you make it ..
 

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I talked with all the other exibitors at the show that was the fun part . Looking at the dogs asking questions and sharing in each other wins and losses. Crying for each other when we lost a dog .. I cannot imagine having to be like that ..How awful ! I have found the poodle people to be quite kind....Everywhere..... I have been to the Las Vegas Specialty the Phoenix Specialty and several other all breed shows and all was positive ...I guess the world is what you make it ..
Ha,ha,ha,ha,ha!!!!
 

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I talked with all the other exibitors at the show that was the fun part . Looking at the dogs asking questions and sharing in each other wins and losses. Crying for each other when we lost a dog .. I cannot imagine having to be like that ..How awful ! I have found the poodle people to be quite kind....Everywhere..... I have been to the Las Vegas Specialty the Phoenix Specialty and several other all breed shows and all was positive ...I guess the world is what you make it ..
Oh were you competing in these shows? Boy putting a positive spin on something that everyone KNOWS is very political and can be extremely catty is one way to go I guess.:wacko:
 

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I think if you live in a state where not a lot of shows occur you will see owner handlers only. The pros try to get majors so they go to more populated shows. I know in CA the only owner handler dogs I see are Irish water spaniels lol. Some hounds breeds and a few from the sporting group.

Pros are every where in CA !
 

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I think if you live in a state where not a lot of shows occur you will see owner handlers only. The pros try to get majors so they go to more populated shows. I know in CA the only owner handler dogs I see are Irish water spaniels lol. Some hounds breeds and a few from the sporting group.

Pros are every where in CA !
Yeah tons of owner handlers at the specialty shows too.:doh: I'm not saying they aren't out there but this "sport" is run with pros. If they didn't win they wouldn't get paid and therefore have no profession.
 
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