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Hi!
We have been looking for a smart breed, sporty and good family pet, at the end of the research we ended with 2 breeds: standard poodle and dobermans.
Have you had both? What are your remarks between the 2 breeds? Any major differences/similarities? Would love your help. Thanks in avance for your time!
 

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I knew someone who had a Doberman and a toy or minipoodle. They got along well, but one day they were playing roughly and the Dobie accidentally broke the poodle's back and it had to be put down.

I have never had a Doberman, but when around 10 years old after my parents divorced, my dad took me to have dinner with a new lady friend who had one. They left me alone, sitting on the sofa to go to the kitchen. After a few minutes I wanted to help out with the food, but that dog growled at me any time I made the slightest move. Stared me down like a hostage and would clearly attack if I tried to get up. I was terrified. The owner said something like "he's not used to guests or kids, and he's a guard dog."

I'm pretty sure this sorta thing rarely if ever happens with poodles.
 

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Hi!
We have been looking for a smart breed, sporty and good family pet, at the end of the research we ended with 2 breeds: standard poodle and dobermans.
Have you had both? What are your remarks between the 2 breeds? Any major differences/similarities? Would love your help. Thanks in avance for your time!
We have had 3 Dobes in our lives. All Registered and from different breeders and all died in the neighbourhood of 7 years. Very different causes. After that I said no more Dobes. Our next companion is our Standard Poodle Dixie. They are similar in temperament although the poodle isn鈥榯 quite as needy. She is happy to lie alone, knowing we are here.
Pro for the Dobe would be little maintenance. Con would be people 鈥漚ssume鈥 they are not friendly. That being said our Dobes had amazing temperaments and no-one had reason to fear them.
Pro for the poodle is their friendliness to everyone. Con would be the required grooming.
We have found they both will do anything to please their owners. Both were very attentive to their owners. I am delighted with my Spoo. Cannot imagine living without her.
That being said, I said the very same words about our Dobes!
 

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A Doberman was always on my list of favorite breeds ever since I was a little girl, along with greyhounds, Standard Poodles, a a few other similar breeds. I鈥檓 typically drawn to the super short haired dogs with the Spoo being the only hairy dog I was drawn to. While I never had my Doberman, I did read a lot about them and have admired many from afar. My first experience and for some reason, the start of my wanting one, was watching a pair of Dobermans guarding a used parking lot when I was a kid. They did a good job. They became bigger than life for me but I always thought they were so beautiful.
My understanding is that they are working dogs and definitely need a job.

I was drawn to Spoos because there was this awesome white Spoo who roamed the neighborhood when I was a kid, back in the day when dogs were free
to roam. 馃槈. He was super friendly with all the neighborhood kids and I always remembered that dog to this day and I am quite sure that is a major reason why I decided on getting our Bobby boy. 馃槈
He totally lives up to my childhood Spoo image. 馃槉
 

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I've always heard their temperaments are similar. Dobermans are more prone to same sex aggression. I know one that is extremely nervy and OCD but there are poor temperaments in every breed. I have met many that are very nice dogs. If you go for show line I do not think their guarding instincts will be too much.

Working line dobermans are a different kettle of fish. They are a lot of dog and would be different than a poodle. The only real working line dobermans (though of questionable quality) that live near me have a reputation for attacking other dogs when their irresponsible owners have them out off leash. I am sure a well trained working line doberman is an excellent dog, but takes a very committed owner.

Really the main drawback to the breed is their health. Dilated Cardiomyopathy is really really prevalent in the breed and so health is really a gamble.
 

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I've known some lovely Dobes and some temperamentally unsound ones. One of the best was a stray Dobe rescued by my elderly next door neighbor. After her hyper Labrador retriever knocked her down in the woods and broke her hip, that loyal Dobe stuck right with her and helped her crawl back to safety. The dog had little interest any human besides her owner, but she was certainly a wonderful dog to the owner. My husband's family also had several Dobes. A couple were incredibly kind, gentle, and protective with the family. One, though, was found with its jaws clamped around a toddler's head. My closest encounter with a nervy Dobe was a German bred one at an acquaintence's house. The dog was very skittish and distrustful of strangers. She wasn't aggressive towards me, as I simply avoided interacting with her, but this dog clearly could have switched to fear aggression mode if mis-handled.
 

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I knew someone who had a Doberman and a toy or minipoodle. They got along well, but one day they were playing roughly and the Dobie accidentally broke the poodle's back and it had to be put down.

I have never had a Doberman, but when around 10 years old after my parents divorced, my dad took me to have dinner with a new lady friend who had one. They left me alone, sitting on the sofa to go to the kitchen. After a few minutes I wanted to help out with the food, but that dog growled at me any time I made the slightest move. Stared me down like a hostage and would clearly attack if I tried to get up. I was terrified. The owner said something like "he's not used to guests or kids, and he's a guard dog."

I'm pretty sure this sorta thing rarely if ever happens with poodles.
My dad has a similar Doberman story. When he was a teen he worked at a shop as a mechanic. One day a Doberman showed up and they called it鈥檚 owner. The third time the dog showed up, the owner said just keep it! So they had a shop dog. Twice they came in to open up the shop and found a would-be thief up on a tool chest. Both times they said, 鈥渉e was so friendly! Until I tried to leave...鈥
 

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I鈥檝e met some exquisite Dobermans. Beautiful in mind and body. But they are working dogs, which require a certain skillset and lifestyle. Standard poodles can be challenging, too, especially for first-time owners. They require a great deal of mental stimulation.

What鈥檚 your experience with dogs and puppies?
 

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I love Dobermans. Always have, always will. However, I'll never get one, I don't think.

The breed is in serious trouble health-wise. The COI is roughly 40%, so the gene pool is horribly small. An estimated 60% will develop Dilated Cardiomyopathy. All too often, the first sign an owner has that their dog even has DCM is when it drops dead of an arrhythmia or goes into congestive heart failure. Doing annual holters and cardiac echos can help catch it in its early stages, but treatment is costly, and the main medication to help control arrhythmias is frequently in short supply. However, early diagnosis and medication can add years to a dog's life.

Breeders should be doing annual holters and echos on all breeding dogs, not just the two genetic marker tests, since those currently don't accurately indicate the dog's chances of developing DCM. If a breeder says that DCM "isn't in my lines", that means they are either uninformed from not testing, delusional, or flat out lying. It is everywhere, in every line, and has been pretty much from the very beginning of the breed.

Beyond cardio, Dobes are also prone to cancer and Cervical Spondylomyelopathy (aka Wobblers). There is also von Willebrands Disease (a bleeding disorder), but that is honestly probably the least of the health concerns.
 

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Note that there are always differences in personalities within the same breed. I purchased a doberman when I moved into my first house. His mom was a family pet (she was very sweet and wanted to be petted) and the dad was a show dog. My puppy was very sweet and the neighborhood kids would come over and play with him. He grew up with an older afghan and several cats in our house. We had our first child when he was about 4 years old and he loved them. My two year old could carry a milk bone back and forth across the family room and he would follow her. He would never ever take it away from her. One time I heard him making a strange noise. I turned around and my two year old was sitting on him holding his tongue in her hand. He never moved. If he would have stood up she would have tumbled off.
Pros - easy to train (he took first place in all his training classes), devoted, serious, easy to groom, mine did not exhibit a strong prey drive
Cons - Sheds (even though the coat is short), he died of a heart attack at age 10, people are afraid of them
I've had a number of poodles since I was a child, two miniatures, and three standards (one of which was a rescue)
Pros - easy to train but they can be jokers, bouncy, sense of humor (my current 80lb standard loves to sit on chairs), doesn't shed, my previous standard passed away at 15 years
Cons - l groom myself and keep mine in a very short cut but you have to brush every week and either bathe/clip yourself (takes me about 4 hours) (cost of good clippers and blades) or take them to a groomer every 6 - 8 weeks ($65 each time). My current two standards are very prey oriented, in our yard bunnies and squirrels don't have a chance. Being bouncy they can knock over a small child. My grandchildren have only come over for short periods but we will see how they get along this summer. When the kids hand them a treat the poodles take it very gently.
I loved all my dogs but according to my vet my doberman was not typical of the breed based on ones that he had seen in his practice. They need to be trained and socialized from an early age.
None of my dogs have ever displayed food aggression, toy guarding, or aggression to other dogs/people.
 

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Both nice breeds..however not typical great for first time dog owners, unless truly committed to training I have often thought of having a doberman but I haven't. My brother however was a doberman fan. His first one was a rescue and he had her 16 years. She was very long lived! and healthy too. A great dog with a great personality. After she passed they got another...dreadful, awful personality, very aggressive and died of heart issues at 5 years old. That dog cured them . They then went to border collies, and have had them ever since. I love poodles but they are indeed a handful to train and require a lot of time to maintain their coats, unless you keep them shaved down which is always an option. I think the above post gave excellent comparisons.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thank you so much for your replies, I was just telling my husband how many answers I got, all super insightful and helpful...
Your comments have help adding good amount of details to our pros-cons I belive.
Let me share how we ended in the Spood path:
I have had dobermans since i was 7, i was my first dog, and since then have had 3, all passed away around 12-13 years old (breast cancer, hip displasia). Then had miniature schnauzer, Yorkshire and then I moved to france in 2012 and been wanting a dobermann, but i was in a small apartment in Paris, so put the dream on hold. 2 years ago I moved to the south of france, a house with a garden, not big but is decent. I have 3 cats, all spayed /neutered. A year ago I got married and my husband has a border mix, spayed 13 years old, male.
I told him I wanted a family dog, to do obidience, sports, a smart breed...came with doberman and standard poodle. so we started the search with the doberman and we went to visit breeders last September, found one and we got put in the waiting list. The litter in December had been fully sold, then there was a plan for mating, but the female didn't get pregnant. We were #5 in the waiting list for a male. No new litters planned at this point. So I started contacting other breeders, out of france this time, and found another one, 14hrs away by car, one litter planned, back on a new list. The breeder called - the mating been postponed... At this point I am fully insync with the idea the universe is telling me "is not the time for a dobermann". Something have been off,I tell myself. This is way too complicated. Granted, I had a list of requirements (health checks, dna etc, show lines, working lines, breeding environment etc etc) but still... It was just on and off on disappointments.

We refocused the search, and contacted the poodle breeder, since based on our search we have been focusing on a smart breed, family oriented and happy to do sports, obidience training. Called the breeder that met our requirements, 8hrs away from us, owns both mom and dad and guess what? She has a litter due on May 1st. We are waiting for a red male puppy... His name will be Sunny Days 鉂 and it feels just right!
 

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Sounds like it was meant to be.
 
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My parents were working Doberman breeders. I grew up & tried to start my own breeding problem. It truly was my biggest dream but in 15 or so years the health of the breed had fallen apart! Our dogs died of old age in their early teens. This was normal to us. When I got my dobes I spent 10 years & went through or interviewed over 200 kennels/breeders world wide. I was not playing around. Dogs & breeding are serious to me. I finally found a line that basically come from Germany, Holland, & Belgium breeders & my foundation male had all the old Doberman traits. My pups' parents, grand parents were all health tested with everything available at that time. This does not have a happy ending. I lost all of my dogs the oldest was 2 days shy of his 6th birthday & the youngest ones (yes plural were 2). Every dog I lost was genetic health problem that involves the immune system & no vet was able to put a name on it except they all believed it was genetic. Boss' medical records were over 50 pounds at the time of his death & our case had been seen by vets in Holland, Germany, Belgium. Some of the breeders of my dog's ancestors were quite helpful but nothing could ever be determined as to what it was. When I lost Boss, I almost stopped anything dog in my life & anyone who knows me that's like telling Big Bird from Sesame Street not to be tall or yellow.

Research all the health issues the breed has & please understand that making certain you are working with an ethical breeder who has had the parents all tested is what you need to do but it's also not an iron clad guarantee. In my case I should have asked (for vWD testing what method or company was the dogs tested through because back then the older type tests were not as effective). I do not know if that's the case now. Most recently I got this article sent to me: An update on the genetic status of the Doberman Pinscher - The Institute of Canine Biology And it's just one article. God spared me from having to see this but one of the young females we had to return to the breeder per our agreement died on the training field of cardio during a workshop training. It was devastating to all of us.

Now pros of Dobermans: This breed has been a life long love of my life. There's not much (except the health problems) that I do not like about the breed. They are sleek, agile, a dog bred without excess. When you look at one you should think they look like they're meant to move fast. You should not find structural lumps & bumps. They are sleek. They are a natural born working dog & should have the stamina, conformation, & temperament to be at ease in the home but jump to full out combat at the sound of someone opening your window without permission. And while the show lines they've tried to unDoberman the breed (meaning make him into the Wal Mart greeter type of dog) please understand this is against what the breed was created for. It's against his very nature & this is a human idea which is inappropriate for the correctness of Doberman. He was created by Herr Doberamnn for the purpose of protecting his humans & that which belongs to his humans. This does NOT mean vicious. Yes, when he goes into combat mode, if you were watching you might think vicious but the Doberman should have a mind that is thinking, that functions through every move he makes, yes, even in bitework. Even if you never want your Doberman to be a protector, he is NOT a Doberman if that is not present within him. I had & helped clients with Doberman puppies who went into hospitals & nursing homes, even child hospitals & they licked faces & were the best of the best. Some of these dogs were some of the finest protectors. My male Boss was 6 times certified to do work that police & federal agents used us for. He would scale scaffolding after a bad guy & engage him ON that scaffolding but he was safe & went with me to visit veterans homes, nursing homes, childrens hospitals. Do not confuse protecting ability with aggression. If the dog is too sharp to be trusted around humans, he is a poorly bred Doberman or poorly handled/trained. He should have special eyes & a stare that brings out confessions from bad people without you asking because they look as they they read your very soul. They are meant to look intimidating (is it not better to have a dog look fierce & never have to bark?). But with his family, he is a clown, so super loving, extremely affectionate, & it's easy to forget that he will bite more than a biscuit. As a baby I would stop breathing in my sleep. Mom had to sleep with her hand on me & when the Dobie pup came, she learned very quickly... baby stops breathing must make her breath. She would bang on my crib & this would wake Mom & between the two of them they'd get me to breathing again. This same dog who could bang on my bed & wake me or poke me with her nose in my tummy & ribs never once put a bruise on me... but she nearly killed one of our hogs when it attacked my Dad. Same dog. This is the true nature of the Doberman & they love deeply. Complete understanding of her place in the family. She would have died to protect any of us. We never disrespected that side of her.

Cons: HEALTH (can't stress that enough), Dobers have tunnel vision. They get so focused on something that they might see wildlife they need to drive from the yard & not see the laundry basket between them & the offending rabbit. Run, run, yelp. Or give you heart palpitations when they see it last second & jump it. They work hard & play hard & this can be a bit much for rambunctious children who get the dog hyped up but aren't physically capable of saying 'enough' & enforcing it. For this reason it's important to be honest about the kids & dogs & have rules & enforce them. Mine learned not to jump up on me if I touched her nose with the inside of a paper towel roll (not strike or slap in the face) I would touch her nose with it & say "no, no, no + her name". To the day she passed if she started to jump on something if I changed my voice to that of a child & said "no, no, no" she would stop & cock her head at me but not put her feet on it. Don't hold the Doberman's favorite toy from one side of the fence & be like, "Look what I've got" because he's apt to jump the fence to get it & now he's learned he can jump your beautiful, once-thought-safe 6 ft fencing. I've seen them go over some insanely high fences. My mother used to summons ours from the barn where they would jump over several fences to free themselves to come help us. You'd just see Dobies flying from all over & they wouldn't look right or left... just little Dobie freight trains coming for mother & us kids.
If any family trouble happens or you get to play wrestling & the kids get to squealing, be mindful that if the Dobe thinks someone is being hurt or if someone gets mad, that dog will step in. While it's unusual for the Dobie to use his teeth to correct a family member, much depends on what's happening how strong he will react.
Another fun thing about Dobermans is if they ever hold a grudge against someone, it's there. My dog saw one of my sister's friends make a grab at me. Now he was only trying to play with me but the dog saw it. To the day she died if that guy came to the house, she got between him & me & there was no redemption in her eyes. He could NOT be trusted with her kid.
Be careful when selecting Dobermans, this is concerning color. There's not enough money in the US Mint to get me to buy from a breeder who has z-factored (white dobermans). It's a huge no-no. I also advise avoidance of fawn or blue Dobermans (yes, I know, most know someone who has gorgeous ones). There can be skin issues in those 2 colors that you don't normally find in the black or brown Dobies. And yes, I use the term brown. Dobermans were never meant to be that brassy red color. The "red" ones are supposed to be the color of melted chocolate. Elsewhere in the world when you speak about dobermans it's black & brown ones. I stick to that custom because it appropriately describes the dogs than red. As a general rule my choice in Dobe colors is black & in the rare exceptional candidate a brown (sigh... red).
And last but not least, Dobermans poke & punch with their noses (so do Giant Schnauzers). So if you get into a staring contest with a Dobie, you are very apt to get a black eye or sore nose because eventually they'll bonk you with their nose. I've a friend who had bonk sized bruises all over his torso when he came home from a tour in the Gulf War & his Doberman was so overcome with joy to see him she about poked him to pieces & he got tickled & was at her poking mercy.


Okay comparison to the Standard Poodle. Like the Doberman, my Standard Poodle, Mr. Layne is an athlete. My boy is bolder & more confident than the average Doberman puppy starting out. At 6 months of age this SPOO would tunnel anywhere (point him at a drain ditch or something else that looks dark & spooky... he'd never hesitate). He will climb & scale rock walls, anything he deems safe. And yes, he will stand at the bottom & thoroughly check it out then... up he goes or he will rear up & test it. If he doesn't like the look of it, he finds another way. This is an indication of a dog who thinks his way through things. And more Malinois like in nature he can think on the fly. Some Dobermans & Giant Schnauzers will just bash through some things... this boy is careful & always thinking & trying to take the smart way. Now the smarter the dog the more clever the handler needs to be however with this SPOO, he is 100% my dog but he loves my husband too & when my husband works with him or is giving him commands he will adjust to suit his handler rather than ignore him. This is a similarity with the Dobermans. Mr. Layne has a little stubborn streak. I do not find this to be a breed trait so much as an individual trait. I sought out a SPOO with the potential to be a guardian/bodyguard. With that comes a level of internal grit that must be present for a dog to stand up to a human bad guy. So it's not a big deal however I don't let him get away with it. As his handler, I always get my way I just often times do this in a way that makes him think it's his idea :) I find my Standard Poodle not as eager in training (again individual vs breed trait as others I've trained with using same methods were like WOW BOSS what're we gonna do next? This boy is like, yeah, okay now what. But if I put him to detecting something, or negotiating obstacles or anything that he's into, he is eager & full of fire. It is when I have him doing those things that you see the true Mr. Layne rather than the "we gotta do this?" dog. Beautiful minds on the SPOOs. Most of the ones I have handled like to show off. Mine is a runner & he could give a Doberman a run for their money, pun intended, in this area. He's tall, lean, & all power. When he stretches out & runs, it is beautiful to see. He shakes the floor like my Giant Schnauzer does when he trots, it's a springy gait that is just poetry in motion. I now understand why people say it's like having a Doberman in drag. The breeds are similar. I believe it's one of the reasons that I was drawn to both the Giant Schnauzer & the Standard Poodle breeds. The similarities I see in them to my beloved Dobermans without the nightmare health. To me, it was far easier to find health tested parents in SPOOs than in Dobermans & to find SPOOs who live nice long lives compared to Dobermans. Other than finding one with protective traits, the Poodle hair was my one deterrent to the breed. I am my dog's groomer. I thought, hey, I've been grooming this Giant for years... I can do this. I gotta tell you Poodle hair does not play nice compared to Giant hair & they both are a pain compared to Doberman hair :) My husband assures me I will in deed get the hang of Poodle hair. I am getting better but... Mr. Layne looks goofy at times. If you take the dog to a pro, wa-la this isn't much of an issue except between groomer visit maintenance.

For us, the Standard Poodle has been one of the easiest puppies we've raised. My Giant wins the prize as the most challenging. Dobermans, all of our Dobies except one are a 2nd to Mr. Layne but because of my lifetime with the breed, it's not fair to say that's true of everyone with their Dobie puppies. You are welcome to message me with any questions or concerns & I'll do my best to help you. I've fallen for the Standard Poodle breed & - in spite of the hair - know that I will have another in the future. Wonderful dogs. I do not believe I will ever have another Doberman due to their health. When it comes to a thinking brain, the Standard Poodle rivals the old Malinois I had. That dog had a brain that was freaky scary but she was a combat dog where as Mr. Layne isn't looking for a war. He's my companion. He rises to the challenge to defend his family & home but he's not looking for a battle... except squirrels, he really hates the squirrels & I have seen this intelligent dog so lost in the world of scent tracking one that he doesn't realize the squirrel he's tracking is following behind him, around & around the tree. It is his one "blind" spot.
 

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My parents were working Doberman breeders. I grew up & tried to start my own breeding problem. It truly was my biggest dream but in 15 or so years the health of the breed had fallen apart! Our dogs died of old age in their early teens. This was normal to us. When I got my dobes I spent 10 years & went through or interviewed over 200 kennels/breeders world wide. I was not playing around. Dogs & breeding are serious to me. I finally found a line that basically come from Germany, Holland, & Belgium breeders & my foundation male had all the old Doberman traits. My pups' parents, grand parents were all health tested with everything available at that time. This does not have a happy ending. I lost all of my dogs the oldest was 2 days shy of his 6th birthday & the youngest ones (yes plural were 2). Every dog I lost was genetic health problem that involves the immune system & no vet was able to put a name on it except they all believed it was genetic. Boss' medical records were over 50 pounds at the time of his death & our case had been seen by vets in Holland, Germany, Belgium. Some of the breeders of my dog's ancestors were quite helpful but nothing could ever be determined as to what it was. When I lost Boss, I almost stopped anything dog in my life & anyone who knows me that's like telling Big Bird from Sesame Street not to be tall or yellow.

Research all the health issues the breed has & please understand that making certain you are working with an ethical breeder who has had the parents all tested is what you need to do but it's also not an iron clad guarantee. In my case I should have asked (for vWD testing what method or company was the dogs tested through because back then the older type tests were not as effective). I do not know if that's the case now. Most recently I got this article sent to me: An update on the genetic status of the Doberman Pinscher - The Institute of Canine Biology And it's just one article. God spared me from having to see this but one of the young females we had to return to the breeder per our agreement died on the training field of cardio during a workshop training. It was devastating to all of us.

Now pros of Dobermans: This breed has been a life long love of my life. There's not much (except the health problems) that I do not like about the breed. They are sleek, agile, a dog bred without excess. When you look at one you should think they look like they're meant to move fast. You should not find structural lumps & bumps. They are sleek. They are a natural born working dog & should have the stamina, conformation, & temperament to be at ease in the home but jump to full out combat at the sound of someone opening your window without permission. And while the show lines they've tried to unDoberman the breed (meaning make him into the Wal Mart greeter type of dog) please understand this is against what the breed was created for. It's against his very nature & this is a human idea which is inappropriate for the correctness of Doberman. He was created by Herr Doberamnn for the purpose of protecting his humans & that which belongs to his humans. This does NOT mean vicious. Yes, when he goes into combat mode, if you were watching you might think vicious but the Doberman should have a mind that is thinking, that functions through every move he makes, yes, even in bitework. Even if you never want your Doberman to be a protector, he is NOT a Doberman if that is not present within him. I had & helped clients with Doberman puppies who went into hospitals & nursing homes, even child hospitals & they licked faces & were the best of the best. Some of these dogs were some of the finest protectors. My male Boss was 6 times certified to do work that police & federal agents used us for. He would scale scaffolding after a bad guy & engage him ON that scaffolding but he was safe & went with me to visit veterans homes, nursing homes, childrens hospitals. Do not confuse protecting ability with aggression. If the dog is too sharp to be trusted around humans, he is a poorly bred Doberman or poorly handled/trained. He should have special eyes & a stare that brings out confessions from bad people without you asking because they look as they they read your very soul. They are meant to look intimidating (is it not better to have a dog look fierce & never have to bark?). But with his family, he is a clown, so super loving, extremely affectionate, & it's easy to forget that he will bite more than a biscuit. As a baby I would stop breathing in my sleep. Mom had to sleep with her hand on me & when the Dobie pup came, she learned very quickly... baby stops breathing must make her breath. She would bang on my crib & this would wake Mom & between the two of them they'd get me to breathing again. This same dog who could bang on my bed & wake me or poke me with her nose in my tummy & ribs never once put a bruise on me... but she nearly killed one of our hogs when it attacked my Dad. Same dog. This is the true nature of the Doberman & they love deeply. Complete understanding of her place in the family. She would have died to protect any of us. We never disrespected that side of her.

Cons: HEALTH (can't stress that enough), Dobers have tunnel vision. They get so focused on something that they might see wildlife they need to drive from the yard & not see the laundry basket between them & the offending rabbit. Run, run, yelp. Or give you heart palpitations when they see it last second & jump it. They work hard & play hard & this can be a bit much for rambunctious children who get the dog hyped up but aren't physically capable of saying 'enough' & enforcing it. For this reason it's important to be honest about the kids & dogs & have rules & enforce them. Mine learned not to jump up on me if I touched her nose with the inside of a paper towel roll (not strike or slap in the face) I would touch her nose with it & say "no, no, no + her name". To the day she passed if she started to jump on something if I changed my voice to that of a child & said "no, no, no" she would stop & cock her head at me but not put her feet on it. Don't hold the Doberman's favorite toy from one side of the fence & be like, "Look what I've got" because he's apt to jump the fence to get it & now he's learned he can jump your beautiful, once-thought-safe 6 ft fencing. I've seen them go over some insanely high fences. My mother used to summons ours from the barn where they would jump over several fences to free themselves to come help us. You'd just see Dobies flying from all over & they wouldn't look right or left... just little Dobie freight trains coming for mother & us kids.
If any family trouble happens or you get to play wrestling & the kids get to squealing, be mindful that if the Dobe thinks someone is being hurt or if someone gets mad, that dog will step in. While it's unusual for the Dobie to use his teeth to correct a family member, much depends on what's happening how strong he will react.
Another fun thing about Dobermans is if they ever hold a grudge against someone, it's there. My dog saw one of my sister's friends make a grab at me. Now he was only trying to play with me but the dog saw it. To the day she died if that guy came to the house, she got between him & me & there was no redemption in her eyes. He could NOT be trusted with her kid.
Be careful when selecting Dobermans, this is concerning color. There's not enough money in the US Mint to get me to buy from a breeder who has z-factored (white dobermans). It's a huge no-no. I also advise avoidance of fawn or blue Dobermans (yes, I know, most know someone who has gorgeous ones). There can be skin issues in those 2 colors that you don't normally find in the black or brown Dobies. And yes, I use the term brown. Dobermans were never meant to be that brassy red color. The "red" ones are supposed to be the color of melted chocolate. Elsewhere in the world when you speak about dobermans it's black & brown ones. I stick to that custom because it appropriately describes the dogs than red. As a general rule my choice in Dobe colors is black & in the rare exceptional candidate a brown (sigh... red).
And last but not least, Dobermans poke & punch with their noses (so do Giant Schnauzers). So if you get into a staring contest with a Dobie, you are very apt to get a black eye or sore nose because eventually they'll bonk you with their nose. I've a friend who had bonk sized bruises all over his torso when he came home from a tour in the Gulf War & his Doberman was so overcome with joy to see him she about poked him to pieces & he got tickled & was at her poking mercy.


Okay comparison to the Standard Poodle. Like the Doberman, my Standard Poodle, Mr. Layne is an athlete. My boy is bolder & more confident than the average Doberman puppy starting out. At 6 months of age this SPOO would tunnel anywhere (point him at a drain ditch or something else that looks dark & spooky... he'd never hesitate). He will climb & scale rock walls, anything he deems safe. And yes, he will stand at the bottom & thoroughly check it out then... up he goes or he will rear up & test it. If he doesn't like the look of it, he finds another way. This is an indication of a dog who thinks his way through things. And more Malinois like in nature he can think on the fly. Some Dobermans & Giant Schnauzers will just bash through some things... this boy is careful & always thinking & trying to take the smart way. Now the smarter the dog the more clever the handler needs to be however with this SPOO, he is 100% my dog but he loves my husband too & when my husband works with him or is giving him commands he will adjust to suit his handler rather than ignore him. This is a similarity with the Dobermans. Mr. Layne has a little stubborn streak. I do not find this to be a breed trait so much as an individual trait. I sought out a SPOO with the potential to be a guardian/bodyguard. With that comes a level of internal grit that must be present for a dog to stand up to a human bad guy. So it's not a big deal however I don't let him get away with it. As his handler, I always get my way I just often times do this in a way that makes him think it's his idea :) I find my Standard Poodle not as eager in training (again individual vs breed trait as others I've trained with using same methods were like WOW BOSS what're we gonna do next? This boy is like, yeah, okay now what. But if I put him to detecting something, or negotiating obstacles or anything that he's into, he is eager & full of fire. It is when I have him doing those things that you see the true Mr. Layne rather than the "we gotta do this?" dog. Beautiful minds on the SPOOs. Most of the ones I have handled like to show off. Mine is a runner & he could give a Doberman a run for their money, pun intended, in this area. He's tall, lean, & all power. When he stretches out & runs, it is beautiful to see. He shakes the floor like my Giant Schnauzer does when he trots, it's a springy gait that is just poetry in motion. I now understand why people say it's like having a Doberman in drag. The breeds are similar. I believe it's one of the reasons that I was drawn to both the Giant Schnauzer & the Standard Poodle breeds. The similarities I see in them to my beloved Dobermans without the nightmare health. To me, it was far easier to find health tested parents in SPOOs than in Dobermans & to find SPOOs who live nice long lives compared to Dobermans. Other than finding one with protective traits, the Poodle hair was my one deterrent to the breed. I am my dog's groomer. I thought, hey, I've been grooming this Giant for years... I can do this. I gotta tell you Poodle hair does not play nice compared to Giant hair & they both are a pain compared to Doberman hair :) My husband assures me I will in deed get the hang of Poodle hair. I am getting better but... Mr. Layne looks goofy at times. If you take the dog to a pro, wa-la this isn't much of an issue except between groomer visit maintenance.

For us, the Standard Poodle has been one of the easiest puppies we've raised. My Giant wins the prize as the most challenging. Dobermans, all of our Dobies except one are a 2nd to Mr. Layne but because of my lifetime with the breed, it's not fair to say that's true of everyone with their Dobie puppies. You are welcome to message me with any questions or concerns & I'll do my best to help you. I've fallen for the Standard Poodle breed & - in spite of the hair - know that I will have another in the future. Wonderful dogs. I do not believe I will ever have another Doberman due to their health. When it comes to a thinking brain, the Standard Poodle rivals the old Malinois I had. That dog had a brain that was freaky scary but she was a combat dog where as Mr. Layne isn't looking for a war. He's my companion. He rises to the challenge to defend his family & home but he's not looking for a battle... except squirrels, he really hates the squirrels & I have seen this intelligent dog so lost in the world of scent tracking one that he doesn't realize the squirrel he's tracking is following behind him, around & around the tree. It is his one "blind" spot.
My parents were working Doberman breeders. I grew up & tried to start my own breeding problem. It truly was my biggest dream but in 15 or so years the health of the breed had fallen apart! Our dogs died of old age in their early teens. This was normal to us. When I got my dobes I spent 10 years & went through or interviewed over 200 kennels/breeders world wide. I was not playing around. Dogs & breeding are serious to me. I finally found a line that basically come from Germany, Holland, & Belgium breeders & my foundation male had all the old Doberman traits. My pups' parents, grand parents were all health tested with everything available at that time. This does not have a happy ending. I lost all of my dogs the oldest was 2 days shy of his 6th birthday & the youngest ones (yes plural were 2). Every dog I lost was genetic health problem that involves the immune system & no vet was able to put a name on it except they all believed it was genetic. Boss' medical records were over 50 pounds at the time of his death & our case had been seen by vets in Holland, Germany, Belgium. Some of the breeders of my dog's ancestors were quite helpful but nothing could ever be determined as to what it was. When I lost Boss, I almost stopped anything dog in my life & anyone who knows me that's like telling Big Bird from Sesame Street not to be tall or yellow.

Research all the health issues the breed has & please understand that making certain you are working with an ethical breeder who has had the parents all tested is what you need to do but it's also not an iron clad guarantee. In my case I should have asked (for vWD testing what method or company was the dogs tested through because back then the older type tests were not as effective). I do not know if that's the case now. Most recently I got this article sent to me: An update on the genetic status of the Doberman Pinscher - The Institute of Canine Biology And it's just one article. God spared me from having to see this but one of the young females we had to return to the breeder per our agreement died on the training field of cardio during a workshop training. It was devastating to all of us.

Now pros of Dobermans: This breed has been a life long love of my life. There's not much (except the health problems) that I do not like about the breed. They are sleek, agile, a dog bred without excess. When you look at one you should think they look like they're meant to move fast. You should not find structural lumps & bumps. They are sleek. They are a natural born working dog & should have the stamina, conformation, & temperament to be at ease in the home but jump to full out combat at the sound of someone opening your window without permission. And while the show lines they've tried to unDoberman the breed (meaning make him into the Wal Mart greeter type of dog) please understand this is against what the breed was created for. It's against his very nature & this is a human idea which is inappropriate for the correctness of Doberman. He was created by Herr Doberamnn for the purpose of protecting his humans & that which belongs to his humans. This does NOT mean vicious. Yes, when he goes into combat mode, if you were watching you might think vicious but the Doberman should have a mind that is thinking, that functions through every move he makes, yes, even in bitework. Even if you never want your Doberman to be a protector, he is NOT a Doberman if that is not present within him. I had & helped clients with Doberman puppies who went into hospitals & nursing homes, even child hospitals & they licked faces & were the best of the best. Some of these dogs were some of the finest protectors. My male Boss was 6 times certified to do work that police & federal agents used us for. He would scale scaffolding after a bad guy & engage him ON that scaffolding but he was safe & went with me to visit veterans homes, nursing homes, childrens hospitals. Do not confuse protecting ability with aggression. If the dog is too sharp to be trusted around humans, he is a poorly bred Doberman or poorly handled/trained. He should have special eyes & a stare that brings out confessions from bad people without you asking because they look as they they read your very soul. They are meant to look intimidating (is it not better to have a dog look fierce & never have to bark?). But with his family, he is a clown, so super loving, extremely affectionate, & it's easy to forget that he will bite more than a biscuit. As a baby I would stop breathing in my sleep. Mom had to sleep with her hand on me & when the Dobie pup came, she learned very quickly... baby stops breathing must make her breath. She would bang on my crib & this would wake Mom & between the two of them they'd get me to breathing again. This same dog who could bang on my bed & wake me or poke me with her nose in my tummy & ribs never once put a bruise on me... but she nearly killed one of our hogs when it attacked my Dad. Same dog. This is the true nature of the Doberman & they love deeply. Complete understanding of her place in the family. She would have died to protect any of us. We never disrespected that side of her.

Cons: HEALTH (can't stress that enough), Dobers have tunnel vision. They get so focused on something that they might see wildlife they need to drive from the yard & not see the laundry basket between them & the offending rabbit. Run, run, yelp. Or give you heart palpitations when they see it last second & jump it. They work hard & play hard & this can be a bit much for rambunctious children who get the dog hyped up but aren't physically capable of saying 'enough' & enforcing it. For this reason it's important to be honest about the kids & dogs & have rules & enforce them. Mine learned not to jump up on me if I touched her nose with the inside of a paper towel roll (not strike or slap in the face) I would touch her nose with it & say "no, no, no + her name". To the day she passed if she started to jump on something if I changed my voice to that of a child & said "no, no, no" she would stop & cock her head at me but not put her feet on it. Don't hold the Doberman's favorite toy from one side of the fence & be like, "Look what I've got" because he's apt to jump the fence to get it & now he's learned he can jump your beautiful, once-thought-safe 6 ft fencing. I've seen them go over some insanely high fences. My mother used to summons ours from the barn where they would jump over several fences to free themselves to come help us. You'd just see Dobies flying from all over & they wouldn't look right or left... just little Dobie freight trains coming for mother & us kids.
If any family trouble happens or you get to play wrestling & the kids get to squealing, be mindful that if the Dobe thinks someone is being hurt or if someone gets mad, that dog will step in. While it's unusual for the Dobie to use his teeth to correct a family member, much depends on what's happening how strong he will react.
Another fun thing about Dobermans is if they ever hold a grudge against someone, it's there. My dog saw one of my sister's friends make a grab at me. Now he was only trying to play with me but the dog saw it. To the day she died if that guy came to the house, she got between him & me & there was no redemption in her eyes. He could NOT be trusted with her kid.
Be careful when selecting Dobermans, this is concerning color. There's not enough money in the US Mint to get me to buy from a breeder who has z-factored (white dobermans). It's a huge no-no. I also advise avoidance of fawn or blue Dobermans (yes, I know, most know someone who has gorgeous ones). There can be skin issues in those 2 colors that you don't normally find in the black or brown Dobies. And yes, I use the term brown. Dobermans were never meant to be that brassy red color. The "red" ones are supposed to be the color of melted chocolate. Elsewhere in the world when you speak about dobermans it's black & brown ones. I stick to that custom because it appropriately describes the dogs than red. As a general rule my choice in Dobe colors is black & in the rare exceptional candidate a brown (sigh... red).
And last but not least, Dobermans poke & punch with their noses (so do Giant Schnauzers). So if you get into a staring contest with a Dobie, you are very apt to get a black eye or sore nose because eventually they'll bonk you with their nose. I've a friend who had bonk sized bruises all over his torso when he came home from a tour in the Gulf War & his Doberman was so overcome with joy to see him she about poked him to pieces & he got tickled & was at her poking mercy.


Okay comparison to the Standard Poodle. Like the Doberman, my Standard Poodle, Mr. Layne is an athlete. My boy is bolder & more confident than the average Doberman puppy starting out. At 6 months of age this SPOO would tunnel anywhere (point him at a drain ditch or something else that looks dark & spooky... he'd never hesitate). He will climb & scale rock walls, anything he deems safe. And yes, he will stand at the bottom & thoroughly check it out then... up he goes or he will rear up & test it. If he doesn't like the look of it, he finds another way. This is an indication of a dog who thinks his way through things. And more Malinois like in nature he can think on the fly. Some Dobermans & Giant Schnauzers will just bash through some things... this boy is careful & always thinking & trying to take the smart way. Now the smarter the dog the more clever the handler needs to be however with this SPOO, he is 100% my dog but he loves my husband too & when my husband works with him or is giving him commands he will adjust to suit his handler rather than ignore him. This is a similarity with the Dobermans. Mr. Layne has a little stubborn streak. I do not find this to be a breed trait so much as an individual trait. I sought out a SPOO with the potential to be a guardian/bodyguard. With that comes a level of internal grit that must be present for a dog to stand up to a human bad guy. So it's not a big deal however I don't let him get away with it. As his handler, I always get my way I just often times do this in a way that makes him think it's his idea :) I find my Standard Poodle not as eager in training (again individual vs breed trait as others I've trained with using same methods were like WOW BOSS what're we gonna do next? This boy is like, yeah, okay now what. But if I put him to detecting something, or negotiating obstacles or anything that he's into, he is eager & full of fire. It is when I have him doing those things that you see the true Mr. Layne rather than the "we gotta do this?" dog. Beautiful minds on the SPOOs. Most of the ones I have handled like to show off. Mine is a runner & he could give a Doberman a run for their money, pun intended, in this area. He's tall, lean, & all power. When he stretches out & runs, it is beautiful to see. He shakes the floor like my Giant Schnauzer does when he trots, it's a springy gait that is just poetry in motion. I now understand why people say it's like having a Doberman in drag. The breeds are similar. I believe it's one of the reasons that I was drawn to both the Giant Schnauzer & the Standard Poodle breeds. The similarities I see in them to my beloved Dobermans without the nightmare health. To me, it was far easier to find health tested parents in SPOOs than in Dobermans & to find SPOOs who live nice long lives compared to Dobermans. Other than finding one with protective traits, the Poodle hair was my one deterrent to the breed. I am my dog's groomer. I thought, hey, I've been grooming this Giant for years... I can do this. I gotta tell you Poodle hair does not play nice compared to Giant hair & they both are a pain compared to Doberman hair :) My husband assures me I will in deed get the hang of Poodle hair. I am getting better but... Mr. Layne looks goofy at times. If you take the dog to a pro, wa-la this isn't much of an issue except between groomer visit maintenance.

For us, the Standard Poodle has been one of the easiest puppies we've raised. My Giant wins the prize as the most challenging. Dobermans, all of our Dobies except one are a 2nd to Mr. Layne but because of my lifetime with the breed, it's not fair to say that's true of everyone with their Dobie puppies. You are welcome to message me with any questions or concerns & I'll do my best to help you. I've fallen for the Standard Poodle breed & - in spite of the hair - know that I will have another in the future. Wonderful dogs. I do not believe I will ever have another Doberman due to their health. When it comes to a thinking brain, the Standard Poodle rivals the old Malinois I had. That dog had a brain that was freaky scary but she was a combat dog where as Mr. Layne isn't looking for a war. He's my companion. He rises to the challenge to defend his family & home but he's not looking for a battle... except squirrels, he really hates the squirrels & I have seen this intelligent dog so lost in the world of scent tracking one that he doesn't realize the squirrel he's tracking is following behind him, around & around the tree. It is his one "blind" spot.
My parents were working Doberman breeders. I grew up & tried to start my own breeding problem. It truly was my biggest dream but in 15 or so years the health of the breed had fallen apart! Our dogs died of old age in their early teens. This was normal to us. When I got my dobes I spent 10 years & went through or interviewed over 200 kennels/breeders world wide. I was not playing around. Dogs & breeding are serious to me. I finally found a line that basically come from Germany, Holland, & Belgium breeders & my foundation male had all the old Doberman traits. My pups' parents, grand parents were all health tested with everything available at that time. This does not have a happy ending. I lost all of my dogs the oldest was 2 days shy of his 6th birthday & the youngest ones (yes plural were 2). Every dog I lost was genetic health problem that involves the immune system & no vet was able to put a name on it except they all believed it was genetic. Boss' medical records were over 50 pounds at the time of his death & our case had been seen by vets in Holland, Germany, Belgium. Some of the breeders of my dog's ancestors were quite helpful but nothing could ever be determined as to what it was. When I lost Boss, I almost stopped anything dog in my life & anyone who knows me that's like telling Big Bird from Sesame Street not to be tall or yellow.

Research all the health issues the breed has & please understand that making certain you are working with an ethical breeder who has had the parents all tested is what you need to do but it's also not an iron clad guarantee. In my case I should have asked (for vWD testing what method or company was the dogs tested through because back then the older type tests were not as effective). I do not know if that's the case now. Most recently I got this article sent to me: An update on the genetic status of the Doberman Pinscher - The Institute of Canine Biology And it's just one article. God spared me from having to see this but one of the young females we had to return to the breeder per our agreement died on the training field of cardio during a workshop training. It was devastating to all of us.

Now pros of Dobermans: This breed has been a life long love of my life. There's not much (except the health problems) that I do not like about the breed. They are sleek, agile, a dog bred without excess. When you look at one you should think they look like they're meant to move fast. You should not find structural lumps & bumps. They are sleek. They are a natural born working dog & should have the stamina, conformation, & temperament to be at ease in the home but jump to full out combat at the sound of someone opening your window without permission. And while the show lines they've tried to unDoberman the breed (meaning make him into the Wal Mart greeter type of dog) please understand this is against what the breed was created for. It's against his very nature & this is a human idea which is inappropriate for the correctness of Doberman. He was created by Herr Doberamnn for the purpose of protecting his humans & that which belongs to his humans. This does NOT mean vicious. Yes, when he goes into combat mode, if you were watching you might think vicious but the Doberman should have a mind that is thinking, that functions through every move he makes, yes, even in bitework. Even if you never want your Doberman to be a protector, he is NOT a Doberman if that is not present within him. I had & helped clients with Doberman puppies who went into hospitals & nursing homes, even child hospitals & they licked faces & were the best of the best. Some of these dogs were some of the finest protectors. My male Boss was 6 times certified to do work that police & federal agents used us for. He would scale scaffolding after a bad guy & engage him ON that scaffolding but he was safe & went with me to visit veterans homes, nursing homes, childrens hospitals. Do not confuse protecting ability with aggression. If the dog is too sharp to be trusted around humans, he is a poorly bred Doberman or poorly handled/trained. He should have special eyes & a stare that brings out confessions from bad people without you asking because they look as they they read your very soul. They are meant to look intimidating (is it not better to have a dog look fierce & never have to bark?). But with his family, he is a clown, so super loving, extremely affectionate, & it's easy to forget that he will bite more than a biscuit. As a baby I would stop breathing in my sleep. Mom had to sleep with her hand on me & when the Dobie pup came, she learned very quickly... baby stops breathing must make her breath. She would bang on my crib & this would wake Mom & between the two of them they'd get me to breathing again. This same dog who could bang on my bed & wake me or poke me with her nose in my tummy & ribs never once put a bruise on me... but she nearly killed one of our hogs when it attacked my Dad. Same dog. This is the true nature of the Doberman & they love deeply. Complete understanding of her place in the family. She would have died to protect any of us. We never disrespected that side of her.

Cons: HEALTH (can't stress that enough), Dobers have tunnel vision. They get so focused on something that they might see wildlife they need to drive from the yard & not see the laundry basket between them & the offending rabbit. Run, run, yelp. Or give you heart palpitations when they see it last second & jump it. They work hard & play hard & this can be a bit much for rambunctious children who get the dog hyped up but aren't physically capable of saying 'enough' & enforcing it. For this reason it's important to be honest about the kids & dogs & have rules & enforce them. Mine learned not to jump up on me if I touched her nose with the inside of a paper towel roll (not strike or slap in the face) I would touch her nose with it & say "no, no, no + her name". To the day she passed if she started to jump on something if I changed my voice to that of a child & said "no, no, no" she would stop & cock her head at me but not put her feet on it. Don't hold the Doberman's favorite toy from one side of the fence & be like, "Look what I've got" because he's apt to jump the fence to get it & now he's learned he can jump your beautiful, once-thought-safe 6 ft fencing. I've seen them go over some insanely high fences. My mother used to summons ours from the barn where they would jump over several fences to free themselves to come help us. You'd just see Dobies flying from all over & they wouldn't look right or left... just little Dobie freight trains coming for mother & us kids.
If any family trouble happens or you get to play wrestling & the kids get to squealing, be mindful that if the Dobe thinks someone is being hurt or if someone gets mad, that dog will step in. While it's unusual for the Dobie to use his teeth to correct a family member, much depends on what's happening how strong he will react.
Another fun thing about Dobermans is if they ever hold a grudge against someone, it's there. My dog saw one of my sister's friends make a grab at me. Now he was only trying to play with me but the dog saw it. To the day she died if that guy came to the house, she got between him & me & there was no redemption in her eyes. He could NOT be trusted with her kid.
Be careful when selecting Dobermans, this is concerning color. There's not enough money in the US Mint to get me to buy from a breeder who has z-factored (white dobermans). It's a huge no-no. I also advise avoidance of fawn or blue Dobermans (yes, I know, most know someone who has gorgeous ones). There can be skin issues in those 2 colors that you don't normally find in the black or brown Dobies. And yes, I use the term brown. Dobermans were never meant to be that brassy red color. The "red" ones are supposed to be the color of melted chocolate. Elsewhere in the world when you speak about dobermans it's black & brown ones. I stick to that custom because it appropriately describes the dogs than red. As a general rule my choice in Dobe colors is black & in the rare exceptional candidate a brown (sigh... red).
And last but not least, Dobermans poke & punch with their noses (so do Giant Schnauzers). So if you get into a staring contest with a Dobie, you are very apt to get a black eye or sore nose because eventually they'll bonk you with their nose. I've a friend who had bonk sized bruises all over his torso when he came home from a tour in the Gulf War & his Doberman was so overcome with joy to see him she about poked him to pieces & he got tickled & was at her poking mercy.


Okay comparison to the Standard Poodle. Like the Doberman, my Standard Poodle, Mr. Layne is an athlete. My boy is bolder & more confident than the average Doberman puppy starting out. At 6 months of age this SPOO would tunnel anywhere (point him at a drain ditch or something else that looks dark & spooky... he'd never hesitate). He will climb & scale rock walls, anything he deems safe. And yes, he will stand at the bottom & thoroughly check it out then... up he goes or he will rear up & test it. If he doesn't like the look of it, he finds another way. This is an indication of a dog who thinks his way through things. And more Malinois like in nature he can think on the fly. Some Dobermans & Giant Schnauzers will just bash through some things... this boy is careful & always thinking & trying to take the smart way. Now the smarter the dog the more clever the handler needs to be however with this SPOO, he is 100% my dog but he loves my husband too & when my husband works with him or is giving him commands he will adjust to suit his handler rather than ignore him. This is a similarity with the Dobermans. Mr. Layne has a little stubborn streak. I do not find this to be a breed trait so much as an individual trait. I sought out a SPOO with the potential to be a guardian/bodyguard. With that comes a level of internal grit that must be present for a dog to stand up to a human bad guy. So it's not a big deal however I don't let him get away with it. As his handler, I always get my way I just often times do this in a way that makes him think it's his idea :) I find my Standard Poodle not as eager in training (again individual vs breed trait as others I've trained with using same methods were like WOW BOSS what're we gonna do next? This boy is like, yeah, okay now what. But if I put him to detecting something, or negotiating obstacles or anything that he's into, he is eager & full of fire. It is when I have him doing those things that you see the true Mr. Layne rather than the "we gotta do this?" dog. Beautiful minds on the SPOOs. Most of the ones I have handled like to show off. Mine is a runner & he could give a Doberman a run for their money, pun intended, in this area. He's tall, lean, & all power. When he stretches out & runs, it is beautiful to see. He shakes the floor like my Giant Schnauzer does when he trots, it's a springy gait that is just poetry in motion. I now understand why people say it's like having a Doberman in drag. The breeds are similar. I believe it's one of the reasons that I was drawn to both the Giant Schnauzer & the Standard Poodle breeds. The similarities I see in them to my beloved Dobermans without the nightmare health. To me, it was far easier to find health tested parents in SPOOs than in Dobermans & to find SPOOs who live nice long lives compared to Dobermans. Other than finding one with protective traits, the Poodle hair was my one deterrent to the breed. I am my dog's groomer. I thought, hey, I've been grooming this Giant for years... I can do this. I gotta tell you Poodle hair does not play nice compared to Giant hair & they both are a pain compared to Doberman hair :) My husband assures me I will in deed get the hang of Poodle hair. I am getting better but... Mr. Layne looks goofy at times. If you take the dog to a pro, wa-la this isn't much of an issue except between groomer visit maintenance.

For us, the Standard Poodle has been one of the easiest puppies we've raised. My Giant wins the prize as the most challenging. Dobermans, all of our Dobies except one are a 2nd to Mr. Layne but because of my lifetime with the breed, it's not fair to say that's true of everyone with their Dobie puppies. You are welcome to message me with any questions or concerns & I'll do my best to help you. I've fallen for the Standard Poodle breed & - in spite of the hair - know that I will have another in the future. Wonderful dogs. I do not believe I will ever have another Doberman due to their health. When it comes to a thinking brain, the Standard Poodle rivals the old Malinois I had. That dog had a brain that was freaky scary but she was a combat dog where as Mr. Layne isn't looking for a war. He's my companion. He rises to the challenge to defend his family & home but he's not looking for a battle... except squirrels, he really hates the squirrels & I have seen this intelligent dog so lost in the world of scent tracking one that he doesn't realize the squirrel he's tracking is following behind him, around & around the tree. It is his one "blind" spot.


beautifully written. Insightful and loving...
after losing our last Dobe, our vet said 鈥渏ust a run of bad luck鈥. I said you have got to be kidding, 3 different breeders, 3 different health problems, three beautiful girls gone away before their time. I am done with Dobes.
After finding our Spoo girl, the same Vet said 鈥渨ow, you have gone from one extreme to the other鈥. it only took a short time realize just how similar the 2 breeds are and to realize we needed a new Vet.
Thanks for sharing your story.
 

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beautifully written. Insightful and loving...
after losing our last Dobe, our vet said 鈥渏ust a run of bad luck鈥. I said you have got to be kidding, 3 different breeders, 3 different health problems, three beautiful girls gone away before their time. I am done with Dobes.
After finding our Spoo girl, the same Vet said 鈥渨ow, you have gone from one extreme to the other鈥. it only took a short time realize just how similar the 2 breeds are and to realize we needed a new Vet.
Thanks for sharing your story.
Agree! All this research have taken us to the same conclusion of how similar the characters "could be" 鉂
 

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Thank you, Beaches. The Doberman is one of the rare things in my life that I've never gotten past or gotten over. I had to walk away but the desire for a healthy, working Doberman... always there. Always just a thought away. They have that effect.

Sunny Days, I hope your Poodle is everything you hope for and more. We of course would love pictures :)
 

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My parents were working Doberman breeders. I grew up & tried to start my own breeding problem. It truly was my biggest dream but in 15 or so years the health of the breed had fallen apart! Our dogs died of old age in their early teens. This was normal to us. When I got my dobes I spent 10 years & went through or interviewed over 200 kennels/breeders world wide. I was not playing around. Dogs & breeding are serious to me. I finally found a line that basically come from Germany, Holland, & Belgium breeders & my foundation male had all the old Doberman traits. My pups' parents, grand parents were all health tested with everything available at that time. This does not have a happy ending. I lost all of my dogs the oldest was 2 days shy of his 6th birthday & the youngest ones (yes plural were 2). Every dog I lost was genetic health problem that involves the immune system & no vet was able to put a name on it except they all believed it was genetic. Boss' medical records were over 50 pounds at the time of his death & our case had been seen by vets in Holland, Germany, Belgium. Some of the breeders of my dog's ancestors were quite helpful but nothing could ever be determined as to what it was. When I lost Boss, I almost stopped anything dog in my life & anyone who knows me that's like telling Big Bird from Sesame Street not to be tall or yellow.

Research all the health issues the breed has & please understand that making certain you are working with an ethical breeder who has had the parents all tested is what you need to do but it's also not an iron clad guarantee. In my case I should have asked (for vWD testing what method or company was the dogs tested through because back then the older type tests were not as effective). I do not know if that's the case now. Most recently I got this article sent to me: An update on the genetic status of the Doberman Pinscher - The Institute of Canine Biology And it's just one article. God spared me from having to see this but one of the young females we had to return to the breeder per our agreement died on the training field of cardio during a workshop training. It was devastating to all of us.

Now pros of Dobermans: This breed has been a life long love of my life. There's not much (except the health problems) that I do not like about the breed. They are sleek, agile, a dog bred without excess. When you look at one you should think they look like they're meant to move fast. You should not find structural lumps & bumps. They are sleek. They are a natural born working dog & should have the stamina, conformation, & temperament to be at ease in the home but jump to full out combat at the sound of someone opening your window without permission. And while the show lines they've tried to unDoberman the breed (meaning make him into the Wal Mart greeter type of dog) please understand this is against what the breed was created for. It's against his very nature & this is a human idea which is inappropriate for the correctness of Doberman. He was created by Herr Doberamnn for the purpose of protecting his humans & that which belongs to his humans. This does NOT mean vicious. Yes, when he goes into combat mode, if you were watching you might think vicious but the Doberman should have a mind that is thinking, that functions through every move he makes, yes, even in bitework. Even if you never want your Doberman to be a protector, he is NOT a Doberman if that is not present within him. I had & helped clients with Doberman puppies who went into hospitals & nursing homes, even child hospitals & they licked faces & were the best of the best. Some of these dogs were some of the finest protectors. My male Boss was 6 times certified to do work that police & federal agents used us for. He would scale scaffolding after a bad guy & engage him ON that scaffolding but he was safe & went with me to visit veterans homes, nursing homes, childrens hospitals. Do not confuse protecting ability with aggression. If the dog is too sharp to be trusted around humans, he is a poorly bred Doberman or poorly handled/trained. He should have special eyes & a stare that brings out confessions from bad people without you asking because they look as they they read your very soul. They are meant to look intimidating (is it not better to have a dog look fierce & never have to bark?). But with his family, he is a clown, so super loving, extremely affectionate, & it's easy to forget that he will bite more than a biscuit. As a baby I would stop breathing in my sleep. Mom had to sleep with her hand on me & when the Dobie pup came, she learned very quickly... baby stops breathing must make her breath. She would bang on my crib & this would wake Mom & between the two of them they'd get me to breathing again. This same dog who could bang on my bed & wake me or poke me with her nose in my tummy & ribs never once put a bruise on me... but she nearly killed one of our hogs when it attacked my Dad. Same dog. This is the true nature of the Doberman & they love deeply. Complete understanding of her place in the family. She would have died to protect any of us. We never disrespected that side of her.

Cons: HEALTH (can't stress that enough), Dobers have tunnel vision. They get so focused on something that they might see wildlife they need to drive from the yard & not see the laundry basket between them & the offending rabbit. Run, run, yelp. Or give you heart palpitations when they see it last second & jump it. They work hard & play hard & this can be a bit much for rambunctious children who get the dog hyped up but aren't physically capable of saying 'enough' & enforcing it. For this reason it's important to be honest about the kids & dogs & have rules & enforce them. Mine learned not to jump up on me if I touched her nose with the inside of a paper towel roll (not strike or slap in the face) I would touch her nose with it & say "no, no, no + her name". To the day she passed if she started to jump on something if I changed my voice to that of a child & said "no, no, no" she would stop & cock her head at me but not put her feet on it. Don't hold the Doberman's favorite toy from one side of the fence & be like, "Look what I've got" because he's apt to jump the fence to get it & now he's learned he can jump your beautiful, once-thought-safe 6 ft fencing. I've seen them go over some insanely high fences. My mother used to summons ours from the barn where they would jump over several fences to free themselves to come help us. You'd just see Dobies flying from all over & they wouldn't look right or left... just little Dobie freight trains coming for mother & us kids.
If any family trouble happens or you get to play wrestling & the kids get to squealing, be mindful that if the Dobe thinks someone is being hurt or if someone gets mad, that dog will step in. While it's unusual for the Dobie to use his teeth to correct a family member, much depends on what's happening how strong he will react.
Another fun thing about Dobermans is if they ever hold a grudge against someone, it's there. My dog saw one of my sister's friends make a grab at me. Now he was only trying to play with me but the dog saw it. To the day she died if that guy came to the house, she got between him & me & there was no redemption in her eyes. He could NOT be trusted with her kid.
Be careful when selecting Dobermans, this is concerning color. There's not enough money in the US Mint to get me to buy from a breeder who has z-factored (white dobermans). It's a huge no-no. I also advise avoidance of fawn or blue Dobermans (yes, I know, most know someone who has gorgeous ones). There can be skin issues in those 2 colors that you don't normally find in the black or brown Dobies. And yes, I use the term brown. Dobermans were never meant to be that brassy red color. The "red" ones are supposed to be the color of melted chocolate. Elsewhere in the world when you speak about dobermans it's black & brown ones. I stick to that custom because it appropriately describes the dogs than red. As a general rule my choice in Dobe colors is black & in the rare exceptional candidate a brown (sigh... red).
And last but not least, Dobermans poke & punch with their noses (so do Giant Schnauzers). So if you get into a staring contest with a Dobie, you are very apt to get a black eye or sore nose because eventually they'll bonk you with their nose. I've a friend who had bonk sized bruises all over his torso when he came home from a tour in the Gulf War & his Doberman was so overcome with joy to see him she about poked him to pieces & he got tickled & was at her poking mercy.


Okay comparison to the Standard Poodle. Like the Doberman, my Standard Poodle, Mr. Layne is an athlete. My boy is bolder & more confident than the average Doberman puppy starting out. At 6 months of age this SPOO would tunnel anywhere (point him at a drain ditch or something else that looks dark & spooky... he'd never hesitate). He will climb & scale rock walls, anything he deems safe. And yes, he will stand at the bottom & thoroughly check it out then... up he goes or he will rear up & test it. If he doesn't like the look of it, he finds another way. This is an indication of a dog who thinks his way through things. And more Malinois like in nature he can think on the fly. Some Dobermans & Giant Schnauzers will just bash through some things... this boy is careful & always thinking & trying to take the smart way. Now the smarter the dog the more clever the handler needs to be however with this SPOO, he is 100% my dog but he loves my husband too & when my husband works with him or is giving him commands he will adjust to suit his handler rather than ignore him. This is a similarity with the Dobermans. Mr. Layne has a little stubborn streak. I do not find this to be a breed trait so much as an individual trait. I sought out a SPOO with the potential to be a guardian/bodyguard. With that comes a level of internal grit that must be present for a dog to stand up to a human bad guy. So it's not a big deal however I don't let him get away with it. As his handler, I always get my way I just often times do this in a way that makes him think it's his idea :) I find my Standard Poodle not as eager in training (again individual vs breed trait as others I've trained with using same methods were like WOW BOSS what're we gonna do next? This boy is like, yeah, okay now what. But if I put him to detecting something, or negotiating obstacles or anything that he's into, he is eager & full of fire. It is when I have him doing those things that you see the true Mr. Layne rather than the "we gotta do this?" dog. Beautiful minds on the SPOOs. Most of the ones I have handled like to show off. Mine is a runner & he could give a Doberman a run for their money, pun intended, in this area. He's tall, lean, & all power. When he stretches out & runs, it is beautiful to see. He shakes the floor like my Giant Schnauzer does when he trots, it's a springy gait that is just poetry in motion. I now understand why people say it's like having a Doberman in drag. The breeds are similar. I believe it's one of the reasons that I was drawn to both the Giant Schnauzer & the Standard Poodle breeds. The similarities I see in them to my beloved Dobermans without the nightmare health. To me, it was far easier to find health tested parents in SPOOs than in Dobermans & to find SPOOs who live nice long lives compared to Dobermans. Other than finding one with protective traits, the Poodle hair was my one deterrent to the breed. I am my dog's groomer. I thought, hey, I've been grooming this Giant for years... I can do this. I gotta tell you Poodle hair does not play nice compared to Giant hair & they both are a pain compared to Doberman hair :) My husband assures me I will in deed get the hang of Poodle hair. I am getting better but... Mr. Layne looks goofy at times. If you take the dog to a pro, wa-la this isn't much of an issue except between groomer visit maintenance.

For us, the Standard Poodle has been one of the easiest puppies we've raised. My Giant wins the prize as the most challenging. Dobermans, all of our Dobies except one are a 2nd to Mr. Layne but because of my lifetime with the breed, it's not fair to say that's true of everyone with their Dobie puppies. You are welcome to message me with any questions or concerns & I'll do my best to help you. I've fallen for the Standard Poodle breed & - in spite of the hair - know that I will have another in the future. Wonderful dogs. I do not believe I will ever have another Doberman due to their health. When it comes to a thinking brain, the Standard Poodle rivals the old Malinois I had. That dog had a brain that was freaky scary but she was a combat dog where as Mr. Layne isn't looking for a war. He's my companion. He rises to the challenge to defend his family & home but he's not looking for a battle... except squirrels, he really hates the squirrels & I have seen this intelligent dog so lost in the world of scent tracking one that he doesn't realize the squirrel he's tracking is following behind him, around & around the tree. It is his one "blind" spot.
Hi DogSavvy, thank you so much fpr sharing your exp茅rience and knowledge. I trully appreciate the passion and kindness that comes put of your story. I agree with you, I think dobermans will always be in heart, maybe in few years, if time is right and we find the right breeder... (Whatever that would mean in few years ..). The health issues we see in europe are devastating and bring so many insecurities to potential owners, like me.
On the SPoo side: I am scared of the poodle grooming. So far i seem to prefer the "teddy bear" cut and also I hope i can maintain it by myself. I am getting all my gear set up, with the help of the breeder advises. will see.
Wish me luck, will share pictures as soon as we get some news!
Thanks again for all your help!
 
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