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Dior The Illest Na Na, Phoebe The Baddest Broad
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My dear sweet Phoebe died of bromethalin toxicity. Bromethalin is a neurotoxin which stops brain function and unlike other forms of rat poison has no antidote. You can only try to get them to throw it up, prevent absorption, and try to reduce its effects.

My mom put tomcat rat poison under my bed (a couple weeks ago) which I had no idea about, and 2 pound Phoebe wiggled her way under there and ate an entire block. I did not notice she had even eaten any until I found it in her stool.

We brought her to the emergency room at 9 AM in the morning where there was a wait lasting a couple hours, and they just had us sit in the car. They treated her at around 7-8pm which was 10-11 hours AFTER we brought her. I will NEVER forgive that practice and I was told she was left unattended numerous times once they got her in.

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Phoebe’s brain had begun to swell and she had stopped breathing, the rest my mom had to take the phone because I couldn’t handle it.

The place I got her from is offering me a replacement puppy for free and the insurance we had for her is covering 80% of everything but I’m not ready for another puppy after the traumatic loss and the treatment at the vet center.

I haven’t even yet buried Phoebe in her casket and I have many questions and hoping someone can help me fully grasp what happened.
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Dior The Illest Na Na, Phoebe The Baddest Broad
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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
To those who use baits for rats and mice I understand it, but bait containing bromethalin which has no antidote is beyond hazardous and needs to be heavily regulated. If a human child were to consume this they’d likely not survive either or end up with serious brain damage. Upon research I’ve heard of this kind of poison taking down dogs up to 55 pounds which is the size of a 10 year old.
 

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@diorthebaddest, I am deleting that tangent and leaving this thread as a place for you to grieve. I am so sorry you had to lose your girl in such a terrible way. :(

I hope others can learn from this pesticide tragedy.
 

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Dior The Illest Na Na, Phoebe The Baddest Broad
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
@diorthebaddest, I am deleting that tangent and leaving this thread as a place for you to grieve. I am so sorry you had to lose your girl in such a terrible way. :(

I hope others can learn from this pesticide tragedy.
thank you sm!
 

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I'm profoundly sad to hear of this tragedy. We grieve with you, remembering our own. The love Phoebe created will always be with you.
 

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I am so, so sorry that you lost little Phoebe. And I am really angry that the vet hospital was so negligent.

I'm sending hugs and hopes that the memories of her are comforting to you.
 

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I am so very, very sorry. I too am shocked that she was not treated immediately, and that such extremely toxic pesticides are available with so little regulation or even warning.
 

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I haven’t even yet buried Phoebe in her casket and I have many questions and hoping someone can help me fully grasp what happened.
I think your dog died due to an unfortunate intersection of three events:

1) Underestimation. Like many families, yours underestimated the ability of pets (and small children) to get into poison. It's an unknown how long your dog had ingested it before you discovered it in her stool that morning, but I'll guess the night before. By that time, a lot of it would have been absorbed into her 2-lb. body.

2) Possibly the Pandemic. Your dog might have been an indirect casualty of Covid. This is similar to many people who had signs of a heart attack or stroke and hoped it was nothing b/c they were fearful about catching it at the ER... but was something and they died. You weren't afraid to go to the vet's office, but their office policy and patient backup was due to their fears of catching Covid.

3) Poison control issues are time sensitive.

"We brought her to the emergency room at 9 AM in the morning where there was a wait lasting a couple hours, and they just had us sit in the car. They treated her at around 7-8pm which was 10-11 hours AFTER we brought her." - @diorthebaddest

Just as not discovering when she ate the poison, a additional two hour wait in your car with the dog from 9 to 11am was time lost. In this case may not have made a difference. Ideally, however, you would have been made aware of that two hour delay and referred to the nearest ER Vet Hospital. This was likely either human error or poor judgement by the vet's office, i.e. they thought they could get her in much faster, but time flew as they dealt with other emergencies. Please remember that an ER Vet Hospital might have been backed up too; it's another unknown - so don't beat yourself up about that.

Unclear is what they did with your dog from 11am to 7-8pm. I'm sure she wasn't just sitting in a cage. My guess is they immediately did the usual treatment for bromethalin rat poison and checked her periodically for observation. I'll guess that wasn't enough so they tried other methods in the evening. Their report should show what that was.

By 8pm at the vet's, your dog would have had ingested the poison likely up to 24 hours earlier, and at 2 lbs she was too small and the ingested quantity too large. Nothing would have worked or saved her.

Dior, I'm very sad along with you that this happened, but I think it was Phoebe's fate. Terrible things do happen to good people and good dogs. I would be mad too, but mainly at fate... and then I'd struggle to not get stuck in the "if only" thinking trap... and then I'd grieve.

One last thought is your breeder was extremely generous to offer you another puppy for free. I've never heard of this happening in accident cases. Never. And like you said, it's too soon, just let her know that in the future when your heart has healed enough, you might be ready to accept her offer.

Here's a cyber hug and you're in my prayers.

~ Vita
 

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I am so, so sorry.

I absolutely hate the availability of mouse poison in stores and the lack of warnings about its use. It's very commonly used in my home town, and the vet is sadly quite familiar with treating it - unfortunately, even with a great vet with lots of experience, recovery isn't guaranteed and dogs that survive may end up with organ damage. Small dogs need such a tiny dose :(

Hugs, I wish I could fix it for you.
 

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I am so sorry. I am sitting here with tears running down my cheeks. And I am wondering what can be done about the pets emergency hospitals. They are not accountable of anything. Just do whatever, make you sign a waiver and charge tons of money for not doing there job. I just had similar experience with Ruger when he broke his leg.
 

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I am so very sorry this has happened to you and to Phoebe. I do understand you not wanting to adopt a new puppy right now, give yourself the time you need to grieve

I know your mom feels awfully horrible as well and would have never wanted this to happen. I hope you all find healing soon.

I'm sending love and light to you in these times. Knowing the future you imagined. It has been seven years since I lost my first personal dog and I still find myself comparing other dogs to her. I felt guilty but I now realize there is no need to I absolutely loved her. Though I can show love to others or even love them just as much she was special in her own way.
 

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I am very sorry for your loss. I also can't imagine being in your Mom's shoes either. A horrible mistake that lead to tragic heartbreak for her daughter. Just remember that the day will come that you look at her picture & just remember the good. Don't dwell on the awful, your beautiful little Phoebe would not be happy knowing you were sad & miserable. That's the beauty of the dog.

I think it is very kind of your breeder to make the offer to you. Right now I want to share a very personal thing that happened in our family. Think on this before you totally refuse that breeder's offer. Long ago I had a male Doberman who was a huge chunk of my heart. He had been sick & we were so connected that his breathing pattern could change at night & bring me out of a sound sleep to care for him. Freaked my husband & Mom out from time to time. I just knew when he needed me. We were battling a bad immune system & when it finally was destroying his eyes, I knew it was time. So that last morning we played games we played when he was a puppy & then, I had to let him go. The... hardest... thing... I have ever done. I couldn't stay with him because I was so upset that he was ready to take on anyone who came near us. So I had to not only lose him but not be with him at the end either. I was devestated & to this day tears flow easily over the loss of this dog but I did not handle his loss well. I very nearly quit all things dog & dog related. This is a problem as I'm a dog trainer, had a full plate of clients & many of those with badges who rely on me to help them. Also didn't help that with what this dog meant, not only to me, but the many officers whom he taught, corrected, & worked with. Even came home one Friday night to a full honor guard down my half mile driveway. The K9 teams were doubled up to fit & had a full service for this dog. What I needed... no one around me was strong enough to do. I'm married to a military man who would take on the devil barehanded in a fight but when I'm upset, he's beside himself.

Flash forward many years, my husband had a little tiny Chihuahua, she weighed 1/4 pound more than your beautiful little girl. She was killed in an accident. My husband is not a big emotional guy but he was a mess. I'd broached the subject on the 2nd day of a puppy & he lost it. But on the 3rd night after her death he cried all night in his sleep. I spent half the night searching. That morning when I woke up I said, "you are getting a puppy... today" & yes, I did in fact not make it an option. I'd found several adds & told him he could go with one of mine or he could find his own but one way or another a new pup was coming. (And to be fair we had already been looking because we were thinking of adding another tiny Chi). He started to argue with me & I was prepared to take whatever he dished out but after the tears stopped he asked me to pull up the listings for him. He went that very day to Phoenix & brought home a little gold colored puppy who is the light of our lives & the boss dog of her very big, tough-guy owner. We'll always miss our little Red Beans but Boo Boo was the best medicine for our grief.

Now I know this is not the way everyone can handle things. I'm not saying this is the only way to handle it. Many mistakenly think that you get a pup to replace the dog you lost. That's not so. You never replace or forget that little light you had & is now gone. But the new puppy, s/he has a way of wriggling their way into your heart & making a place of its very own. Never to replace but to make a space for themselves, like Boo Boo did. She was never bothered by the tears he still shed for his little lost girl, she just licked his face & snuggled up with him & when the tears were past, she'd bite his nose & snuggle some more. I know right now it seems impossible.

You'll be in my prayers & I'm sending cyber hugs.
 

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Hugs. My childhood heart dog died after getting hit by a car after digging out from under our fence. It wasn't a quick death; he had an internal rupture the vet didn't find immediately. The poor dog lingered for almost two weeks.

The thing his death taught me is that blame can really cut you up inside. Maybe if my vet was more experienced or had better diagnostic equipment he would have found the leak in time to save my dog. Maybe if we'd spent money on better fencing my dog wouldn't have tunneled out. Maybe if I'd taken the dog on a walk instead of trusting the fence the dog wouldn't have escaped. Maybe if we'd neutered him instead of leaving him intact he wouldn't have wanted to go roaming. However, no amount of guilt, blame, and what-ifs were going to bring him back.

The best I could do was learn from my mistakes and do better by my next dog.
 
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