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:laugh: I know I know... this is a overdone topic... I just have one question; Does anyone out there own a Standard Red that is over 3 years old and has not faded?
There is so much talk about bad blacks and non-fading browns that it just got me thinking...... I've seen some really nice older blacks lately that are still a deep, dark, inky black, and a few deep browns that are still a rich chocolate brown even at 5 and 6 years old... but really, I don't think I've ever seen a red at that age that has not faded to an apricot shade of some sort. I would love to see if there are any "good REDS" out there!
As most of you know, I have a wonderful 5month old red pup that I love with all my heart. I am fully aware that he will most likely fade to a nice apricot color and I'm ok with that.
I just want to see if any of those claims about non-fading REDS actually exist. :)
Ginger is 4 and is still red but she has a lot of white hairs within her coat now so she is lighted than she used to be but still red I wouldn't call her apricot - she is still red. and its funny - some days she looks redder than others - and after a bath she looks redder (all the dirt gone? lol)
 

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Ginger is 4 and is still red but she has a lot of white hairs within her coat now so she is lighted than she used to be but still red I wouldn't call her apricot - she is still red. and its funny - some days she looks redder than others - and after a bath she looks redder (all the dirt gone? lol)
Here are the lastest pictures of her -she looks redder in the sunlight
 

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I wouldn't call most of the reds that fade apricot. If you see an actual apricot and a faded red saide by side, the tones of their coats are entirely different. Apricots are yellow toned, reds are golden or rust. So even when a red fades, it is obviously still red.
 

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BTW...now I feel guilty. I took photos of last years litter under a red light, but not to enhance ( it actually did nothing to improve the colour!!) but rather because the babies happened to be under a heat lamp and I just went in to them to take candid photos of them. I was not trying to mislead anyone. I didn't need to because their colour was fabulous, but if anyone thinks that was my intent, I appologize!
 

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As time goes on in the red breeding program we will see. I think that there are reds out there that are holding the color. The problem is the health as well . We need to be sure that we are testing the foundation reds for not just color but other things as well. I have color tested all my reds and none of them carry the fading Gene.It is also important for me to breed for the black points, so this is another reason that I color test. I have been contacted by folks that have reds that do. So The fact that DDC said a red has never tested poitive for the fading gene is incorrect. I would never tell a prospective puppy buyer that my reds do not fade !!!!!We just do not know yet !!!!
 

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I wouldn't call most of the reds that fade apricot. If you see an actual apricot and a faded red saide by side, the tones of their coats are entirely different. Apricots are yellow toned, reds are golden or rust. So even when a red fades, it is obviously still red.
I agree I do not know why people try to call a faded dog another color just because it faded. If it was born red and was read for a few years its a red :D

BTW...now I feel guilty. I took photos of last years litter under a red light, but not to enhance ( it actually did nothing to improve the colour!!) but rather because the babies happened to be under a heat lamp and I just went in to them to take candid photos of them. I was not trying to mislead anyone. I didn't need to because their colour was fabulous, but if anyone thinks that was my intent, I appologize!

HAHAHA Its ok it was not you that I saw doing this , I never seen your picture anyways. It was some BYB on puppy find she was obviously using the light to make the pups look redder.

I have color tested all my reds and none of them carry the fading Gene.
See here is the problem Vetgen stated they have not found the fading Gene . If I recall D = dilute gene and this is not the fading gene. Labs carry D genes and I never seen any lab fade same with dobies.....
 

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I agree I do not know why people try to call a faded dog another color just because it faded. If it was born red and was read for a few years its a red :D




HAHAHA Its ok it was not you that I saw doing this , I never seen your picture anyways. It was some BYB on puppy find she was obviously using the light to make the pups look redder.



See here is the problem Vetgen stated they have not found the fading Gene . If I recall D = dilute gene and this is not the fading gene. Labs carry D genes and I never seen any lab fade same with dobies.....
dd is fading DD is not
 

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dd is fading DD is not
but D is for dilute gene not fading gene , so you dogs just do not carry the dilute gene.

I emailed Vetgen and this was the reply

"We do not have discovery of the gene that would cause this.

We are not aware of its availability elsewhere.

Thank you for your inquiry.



Regards,



Ann Arnold

[email protected]"
 

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Well then so they have been taking our money .... Hmm interesting. So we are back to looking at pedigrees..Which i do as well the color test is pretty much a joke from what you are saying saves me almost 80 per dog HA HA !!!
 

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Well then so they have been taking our money .... Hmm interesting. So we are back to looking at pedigrees..Which i do as well the color test is pretty much a joke from what you are saying saves me almost 80 per dog HA HA !!!
You know what when I first started to learn about red I was so CONFUSED into what people where talking about with the fading gene being D allele. Because the Dilution gene is present in a lot of breeds that do not fade. Since I was into apbt , this breed comes in Blue a lot and they are called dilutes and most likely if you tested them they would be dd. Since more experience people where telling me about the fading gene being d I never questioned them. It never really made since to me lol Cbrand also made me question it even more so this is why I emailed Vetgen.
 

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Now my mind got to thinking maybe if your dog tested out dd this means a liver nose ? or the dogs nose will end up liver and not completely black ?

I have seen poodles noses change colors. In apbt there are two types of reds. One is a red red like how your red poodles are and one is a Red nose. I wonder if the red nose apbt would test out as dd since I think they area a dilute also ( I am not sure )

red apbt with black points
http://www.amberlitekennels.com/bogan.html ( this color is hard to come by in apbt)


red nose apbt

http://www.caragankennel.com/females.html
 

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I wonder ?
I am concerned about brown being present so I will still test for that but save myself the DD test. Love the pics of the Pitties .. Thanks for sharing :)
 

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Now my mind got to thinking maybe if your dog tested out dd this means a liver nose ? or the dogs nose will end up liver and not completely black ?

I have seen poodles noses change colors. In apbt there are two types of reds. One is a red red like how your red poodles are and one is a Red nose. I wonder if the red nose apbt would test out as dd since I think they area a dilute also ( I am not sure )

red apbt with black points
http://www.amberlitekennels.com/bogan.html ( this color is hard to come by in apbt)


red nose apbt

http://www.caragankennel.com/females.html
I would not breed a litter with brown . So I am not sure about that . So far I have talked to one person who has browns in the pedigree and there were brown noses in the litter Her bitch is Dd and so we know that to be true in this case. So in the future is she breeds to a DD will the babies be DD or Dd interesting, we will find out :)
 

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I would not breed a litter with brown . So I am not sure about that . So far I have talked to one person who has browns in the pedigree and there were brown noses in the litter Her bitch is Dd and so we know that to be true in this case. So in the future is she breeds to a DD will the babies be DD or Dd interesting, we will find out :)
Was this a poodle or a apbt ? A brown dog with black nose ?
 

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Hm.. Yeeah.. everything you guys are saying is pretty much going "WHOOSH" right over my head. :D

So.. is a fading gene okay in whites? Since I see a lot of them born with cream or apricot on them, normally the ears, but are very white when they grow up with still very dark points.
 
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