Hello everyone, I am finally on a search for a miniature poodle pup after waiting for several years in order for things to line up. I now have a stable income and feel can properly care for a dog. I'm looking at miniature poodle breeders in the Toronto and surrounding area. I have found a few and sent off emails but have not heard a response as yet. Do any of you have suggestions to point me towards for good breeders in this area? Thanks!
Miniature Poodle Breeder - Toronto
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Hi and Welcome!
Not knowing your experience with dogs in general, poodles in particular, and poodle breeders, I'll drop in a link to the Breeders List and some other resources.
The Canadian listings are below the US listings. Don't rule out breeders in the US. I'm not sure if importing is possible at this time but it can't hurt to look. The health testing info is relevant on both sides of the border, as is the official Poodle Club suggestions and multi lists.
🐩 Breeders Listed by Location 🐩 Plus Additional Resources 🐩
GEOGRAPHICAL BREEDERS LIST AND ADDITIONAL RESOURCES PLEASE READ THIS FIRST What this list is NOT: This list is not an endorsement of any breeder by Poodle Forum This list is not a list to just go buy from without doing more investigation This list is not comprehensive What this list IS: This...
If you look thru that list, review the Health information (great strides there in the science), then don't skip the multi state listings, and particularly don't skip the Poodle Club of America Breeder Referral for your region (or search "Poodle Club of ___").
Conscientious breeders have a waitlist at the best of times and with pandemic puppy seekers, that wait is stretched well into 2021. There have been more than a few serendipitous contacts between seeker and breeder, so don't be put off by the thought of a waitlist. Also, don't be put off if online sites aren't particularly updated.
Be prepared to spend in the range of $1500 to up to $3000 USD at the top end. Conscientious breeders are not padding pricing due to Covid.
I will also add my personal criteria for selecting a breeder that might be helpful as a sort of checklist.
There's links to the OFA site and a couple of links to older threads here at PF with some of our members, some breeders, discussing breeding age.
My criteria need not be yours but I think it's important for a potential poodle owner to understand why these criteria are important in choosing a conscientious breeder and to get a well bred puppy to share life with for many years to come.
Every one of these is a talking point a conscientious breeder will welcome, just not all at the same time
My ideal breeder is someone who is doing this because they love the breed.
They want to see each new generation born at least as good as the previous, ideally better.
They provide for every dog in their care as if that dog is their own.
They will be there for the new family, and stand behind that pup for it's lifetime, rain or shine, with or without a contract.
They will know the standards and pedigrees of their chosen breed, health and genetic diversity of their lines, and breed to better them.
They will know of the latest studies in health standards for their chosen breed and variety and do the health testing of their breeding dogs.
They will have as many questions for me as I do for them.
They invest in their dogs. They don't expect the dogs to support them.
Breeding Program
! to maintain, improve, strengthen the breed by breeding to standard, and for health and genetic diversity,
and will prove their dogs meet these standards by showing or competing or by breeding from titled parents.
It's not the title, but what it shows
! focus is on quality, never quantity
! they do not cross breed
! they limit breeding to one to two breeds
! they limit breeding to only a few litters per year *
Breeding Parents
! registry information available
AKC Registry Lookup
https://www.apps.akc.org/apps/store/search/dog_lookup.cfm?returnpage=undefined&_=2770
! not too old or young for breeding
! not overbred
see https://www.poodleforum.com/threads/asking-questions-from-a-breeder.273579/post-3294246
and https://www.poodleforum.com/threads/frequency-of-breeding-a-bitch.20388/
! genetic health testing done appropriate to breed and variety
! other health testing by exam such as annual eye, hips, patellas
! results of testing on own website, OFA site or testing lab
see http://vipoodle.org/health/health-related-publications/
and OFA Lookup https://www.ofa.org/look-up-a-dog
Living Conditions
! in home with family
! breeder allows, even encourages home visits
Puppies
! routine and urgent vet care, immunizations, dewormings
! socialization
! first groomings
! registry papers
! they will not require spay/neuter before physical maturity
! health "guarantee" generally favors the breeder, not the buyer.
health guarantee is no replacement for health testing of dam and sire.
does the contract/guarantee/warranty rule out covering conditions the parents should have been tested for
do you fully understand the terms of any contract/guarantee/warranty and can you live with them
beginning housetraining is a bonus
temperament testing is helpful
Advertising
! individual website to detail history of breeder, goals for their program
! information on dams, sires, puppies
! no trend pricing for color, gender or size,
! no marketing gimmick terms like "teacup" "royal"
! Anything not found on a public online site should be provided by breeder before buying.
* Many people prefer small scale breeders because they feel the puppies will have better socialization and it's very unlikely to be a puppy mill-like operation.
This doesn't mean that larger scale breeders can't do things right. The breeder of record may not be hands on with every pup or poodle on the place but they should make sure that all the quality of life and attention are paid to all their dogs.
If a breeder wants me to believe that they believe in their dogs, they won't stop the investment when it comes time to find the new families. If they want to cut costs by using free advertising sites like craigslist or listing on retail marketplaces like puppyspot or puppyfind, or other classified ad sites such as newspapers, I wonder what else they've cut costs on.
Contact a few breeders to introduce yourself. Even if they don't have or don't offer what you're looking for, it can be a close knit community. They may know where to refer you.
Not knowing your experience with dogs in general, poodles in particular, and poodle breeders, I'll drop in a link to the Breeders List and some other resources.
The Canadian listings are below the US listings. Don't rule out breeders in the US. I'm not sure if importing is possible at this time but it can't hurt to look. The health testing info is relevant on both sides of the border, as is the official Poodle Club suggestions and multi lists.
🐩 Breeders Listed by Location 🐩 Plus Additional Resources 🐩
GEOGRAPHICAL BREEDERS LIST AND ADDITIONAL RESOURCES PLEASE READ THIS FIRST What this list is NOT: This list is not an endorsement of any breeder by Poodle Forum This list is not a list to just go buy from without doing more investigation This list is not comprehensive What this list IS: This...
If you look thru that list, review the Health information (great strides there in the science), then don't skip the multi state listings, and particularly don't skip the Poodle Club of America Breeder Referral for your region (or search "Poodle Club of ___").
Conscientious breeders have a waitlist at the best of times and with pandemic puppy seekers, that wait is stretched well into 2021. There have been more than a few serendipitous contacts between seeker and breeder, so don't be put off by the thought of a waitlist. Also, don't be put off if online sites aren't particularly updated.
Be prepared to spend in the range of $1500 to up to $3000 USD at the top end. Conscientious breeders are not padding pricing due to Covid.
I will also add my personal criteria for selecting a breeder that might be helpful as a sort of checklist.
There's links to the OFA site and a couple of links to older threads here at PF with some of our members, some breeders, discussing breeding age.
My criteria need not be yours but I think it's important for a potential poodle owner to understand why these criteria are important in choosing a conscientious breeder and to get a well bred puppy to share life with for many years to come.
Every one of these is a talking point a conscientious breeder will welcome, just not all at the same time
My ideal breeder is someone who is doing this because they love the breed.
They want to see each new generation born at least as good as the previous, ideally better.
They provide for every dog in their care as if that dog is their own.
They will be there for the new family, and stand behind that pup for it's lifetime, rain or shine, with or without a contract.
They will know the standards and pedigrees of their chosen breed, health and genetic diversity of their lines, and breed to better them.
They will know of the latest studies in health standards for their chosen breed and variety and do the health testing of their breeding dogs.
They will have as many questions for me as I do for them.
They invest in their dogs. They don't expect the dogs to support them.
Breeding Program
! to maintain, improve, strengthen the breed by breeding to standard, and for health and genetic diversity,
and will prove their dogs meet these standards by showing or competing or by breeding from titled parents.
It's not the title, but what it shows
! focus is on quality, never quantity
! they do not cross breed
! they limit breeding to one to two breeds
! they limit breeding to only a few litters per year *
Breeding Parents
! registry information available
AKC Registry Lookup
https://www.apps.akc.org/apps/store/search/dog_lookup.cfm?returnpage=undefined&_=2770
! not too old or young for breeding
! not overbred
see https://www.poodleforum.com/threads/asking-questions-from-a-breeder.273579/post-3294246
and https://www.poodleforum.com/threads/frequency-of-breeding-a-bitch.20388/
! genetic health testing done appropriate to breed and variety
! other health testing by exam such as annual eye, hips, patellas
! results of testing on own website, OFA site or testing lab
see http://vipoodle.org/health/health-related-publications/
and OFA Lookup https://www.ofa.org/look-up-a-dog
Living Conditions
! in home with family
! breeder allows, even encourages home visits
Puppies
! routine and urgent vet care, immunizations, dewormings
! socialization
! first groomings
! registry papers
! they will not require spay/neuter before physical maturity
! health "guarantee" generally favors the breeder, not the buyer.
health guarantee is no replacement for health testing of dam and sire.
does the contract/guarantee/warranty rule out covering conditions the parents should have been tested for
do you fully understand the terms of any contract/guarantee/warranty and can you live with them
beginning housetraining is a bonus
temperament testing is helpful
Advertising
! individual website to detail history of breeder, goals for their program
! information on dams, sires, puppies
! no trend pricing for color, gender or size,
! no marketing gimmick terms like "teacup" "royal"
! Anything not found on a public online site should be provided by breeder before buying.
* Many people prefer small scale breeders because they feel the puppies will have better socialization and it's very unlikely to be a puppy mill-like operation.
This doesn't mean that larger scale breeders can't do things right. The breeder of record may not be hands on with every pup or poodle on the place but they should make sure that all the quality of life and attention are paid to all their dogs.
If a breeder wants me to believe that they believe in their dogs, they won't stop the investment when it comes time to find the new families. If they want to cut costs by using free advertising sites like craigslist or listing on retail marketplaces like puppyspot or puppyfind, or other classified ad sites such as newspapers, I wonder what else they've cut costs on.
Contact a few breeders to introduce yourself. Even if they don't have or don't offer what you're looking for, it can be a close knit community. They may know where to refer you.
Joined
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1,059 Posts
Here's one listing for litters, Poodle Breeders - Standard, Miniature and Toy Poodle puppies. I have no knowledge of or experience with the listed breeder.
Enchantment Poodles |
Ontario, Canada |
| Information about Enchantment Poodles |
| Litter Plans: Two black miniature litters planned for 2021. (10-27-20) |
Thank you both so much! There's a wealth of info on this site and I am glad I finally made an account to correspond and learn from you all. I did take a look at that 'Breeders Listed by Location' and noted a few contacts. I have contacted Enchantment Poodles as well. I have been contacting them by email but haven't really received a response for those that I contacted last week. I think I did the initial contact right by stating who I am, what I do, why I want a miniature poodle specifically. This will be my first dog and I've been waiting for years till I finished my schooling and grad school to be in a financially secure place to finally look at getting a dog.
I've never considered contacting sellers in the US. Is that normal, to import dogs? Wouldn't it be important to visit the parents and see the living conditions of the puppies in person? Maybe I will have to expand my search to out of the country because there are so few mini poodle breeders that I've found. I don't mind waiting! I've waited this long so another year or two won't matter in the grand scheme of things. I only wish they would get back to my initial emails so I know if they would consider me for a puppy or not. 😊
I've never considered contacting sellers in the US. Is that normal, to import dogs? Wouldn't it be important to visit the parents and see the living conditions of the puppies in person? Maybe I will have to expand my search to out of the country because there are so few mini poodle breeders that I've found. I don't mind waiting! I've waited this long so another year or two won't matter in the grand scheme of things. I only wish they would get back to my initial emails so I know if they would consider me for a puppy or not. 😊
I found this poodle breeder under CKC's listings of local breeders: https://mrfpoodles.com
Does anyone have any insight if everything looks good here?
Does anyone have any insight if everything looks good here?
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1,915 Posts
I looked at their web site and was not impressed at all. I think you can do much better. Try telephoning Enchantment poodles - many people are just not very good at email.
Could you tell me why you weren't impressed by them? Just so I can learn to spot red flags on my own in the future. I assumed that since they were listed under CKC's list of breeders they must be OK.
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7,968 Posts
The poodles look scruffy, not one is beautiful groomed. Cannot tell if their conformation is good or not from those photos.
They are not taking their dogs to competition in conformation to prove that they are worthy of breeding. On their website they state “MRF Poodles have been breeding champion linage 100% Certified Canadian Kennel Club” Somewhere back in time they did get a nice puppy from a quality breeder. If you look elsewhere you can get a poodle from a quality breeder too.
Quality breeders show in conformation or other dog sports to prove their dogs have the right personality and conformation. Before they breed they do all the recommended testing (Poodle Club of America) on their dogs, some of which can’t be done until dogs are 2 yo. They know the good points of their dogs and the weak points. They search carefully for a good match to improve the breed by looking for mates who are genetically diverse and who have strengths where their dog has weaknesses. They may travel long distances for the best mate.
You can’t always tell who is a good breeder from a website, good breeders may not be tech savvy. You can look up the pedigree of good breeders, the AKC titles and health test results, or the breeder can show you proof. I do expect photos to show well groomed dogs.
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