Poodle Forum banner

41 - 60 of 82 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter · #41 ·
@Rose n Poos We live outside of Philadelphia. I would be completely shocked if I got my deposit back. We are only an hour from the breeder but the impression I got was that they are not allowing visits at the moment. I am double checking on that...

Ugh my kids are going to be SO upset. I mean I know in the long run this is probably best but....
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,025 Posts
Another direction of thought...You've mentioned BT's who range in the small/medium size. You also mentioned that you felt 20lbs was a good weight.

Here's the other direction. Weight isn't really the determiner for poodles, height is. A standard can be a lot of dog, especially for a poodle novice. Have you considered a miniature? As puppies, they're smaller of course but when adult size they are a great size for a family. Smaller also means a smaller allergy potential.

A range of photos, mpoo puppy to adult. My two are full grown at 13-14"/13-14lbs for the larger and 12-13"/12-13lbs for the smaller.

8w
475422


16w
475423


Full grown mpoos

Neo extended next to DH who is 5'9"


469174




Neo in arms


469175




Neo at the kitchen table (terrible photo)


469176




Neo at the kitchen counter (boy loves his food)


469177



FYI, standards can eat off the kitchen counter :)
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,025 Posts
If you express your concerns over the allergy potential, I'd hope the breeder would work to accommodate you. This isn't just a whim and could make rehoming necessary. I'd hope the breeder would prefer to avoid that,
 
  • Like
Reactions: kontiki

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter · #44 ·
@Rose n Poos Brittanys are square as well - so very leggy for the size. We were fine with a bigger dog. I definitely wanted something at least 20lbs.

I had also read that standards were considered to be more kid friendly than minis. Although less allergy friendly I suppose.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,025 Posts
I had also read that standards were considered to be more kid friendly than minis
Not knowing your sources and not ever having any size but mini's, I can't speak to that. I would fall back on earlier comments (I think in this thread) that it's the individual temperament more than size.

Are you familair with Volhard testing? Choosing Your Puppy (PAT) | Volhard Dog Nutrition

Beyond the allergy issues, you'd be looking for what's called an "easy keeper". I want to say that's a pup that scores in the 3's but haven't reviewed the scoring before posting.
 
  • Like
Reactions: kontiki

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,025 Posts
We've got them too, as well as coyotes. I never let them be outside alone as small pups in our fenced yard and even now, I'm either out with them or supervising pretty closely. I don't worry about the hawks now, and less concerned over the other wildlife generally, but still am vigilant. This is as much now so I can see what the heck they're trying to eat out there lol.

475425
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
41 Posts
So some additional thoughts from me - I too was scrolling through Poodle Forum, Reddit’s Puppy101 posts, and googling all sorts of things while waiting for Kuzco. I was very excited to finally get my puppy (had only had family dogs up until then and had been a while since having that AND the first litter I was supposed to get a puppy from, I ended up getting a promotion and had to postpone due to training). After reading posts/as the puppy date got closer, I also got very nervous. I think it’s similar to looking at reviews on doctor’s offices and Amazon products, etc - often only the negative/problematic experiences are documented because people who are happy with something don’t seek out help or spend the time to post their experiences. I have to tell myself to stop looking sometimes haha.

And the first week I had him, the lack of sleep and some other changes in my personal life had me very stressed (including new BC hormones - very killer) and telling my boyfriend and parents I wanted to give Kuzco back. After a quick trip home (with some encouragement from momma) and some time and sleep, it got so much better. Now, I look at Kuz sleeping or investigating a new package that was delivered or chewing with his mouth open, my heart swells with love and I readily agree when my boyfriend says “I told you so. You tried to give him back and now you take 50 pictures of him sleeping.” You have the experience of sleeplessness with two kids, I’m sure, and can hopefully delegate some tasks to kids or husband (even if that’s just watching the puppy while you cook or shower).

The fact you did research and put the deposit shows you put thought into it. Trust yourself and trust the reviews/rankings of poodles. Be prepared to be consistent, firm, and patient and I truly think you’ll be ok.

Also, my breeder was not great about responding quickly and sending pictures as she was in the process of opening a restaurant. However, I was nice but persistent when I had questions and concerns. You are a customer and about to be entrusted with a living thing. They understand that it is part of the job and that some new owners will need more than others. Reach out and talk to them and see what happens - it definitely can’t hurt!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,558 Posts
For whatever reason, his allergy symptoms don’t seem to show up immediately. I honestly believe he has to spend several days with a dog before it starts to affect him. We have had this experience with dog sitting dogs that he’s visited before. Once they are in the house with him for a day or two, he reacts.
I’m the same, which is why I always tell breeders, before buying a puppy or older dog that there is a chance that I might react to the dog, and if that’s the case, I need to return the dog to them. So far they’ve all agreed and I’ve had to return one dog (chihuahua).

I will react after 3-4 days, then I give myself 1-2 weeks to see where it’s going and if it gets worse or doesn’t improve, I will bring the dog back. 2-3 weeks is the longest I will keep the dog, knowing that I am breaking my own heart, and disrupting a puppy’s life. Longer than that would not be fair to the dog.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter · #51 ·
@Dechi I was just hoping that if I did end up having to return in the first few days that they would be nice and refund me. They definitely want their dogs back if things don’t work out, but they have no interest in refunding the purchase price. I can understand if I have the puppy for a while, but if we know within a few days, that’s quite a lot of money to lose.
 

·
Registered
Standard Poodle (arriving April 21st !!)
Joined
·
458 Posts
I think we have chosen a reputable breeder. I checked with the poodle club and they confirmed that this breeder is in good standing with the club, etc.

Have I reached out to the breeder with concerns? No.. I feel like I am bothering them when I even ask for pictures.
You really need to get on the phone and talk with your breeder. A good breeder understands allergies and should be able to accommodate you in some way or another. They almost always have more buyers than they do puppies, so I can't imagine a good breeder not giving you a refund if your child is allergic. They can easily sell him again in the blink of an eye. You said you feel like you are bothering them asking for pictures, what makes you think that? It's probably not the case, and likely a misinterpretation on your part. Don't be afraid to call. This is a major life change, and you need to do what's best for everyone. If the breeder refuses to give you a refund in the case your child is allergic, then you've learned for sure this isn't the best breeder for you. Best of luck to you!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,421 Posts
@Dechi I was just hoping that if I did end up having to return in the first few days that they would be nice and refund me. They definitely want their dogs back if things don’t work out, but they have no interest in refunding the purchase price. I can understand if I have the puppy for a while, but if we know within a few days, that’s quite a lot of money to lose.
Most breeders will be happy to make such an agreement.

I would consider why you are feeling cold feet. Poodles are not difficult dogs in general for those with dog experience. They are a lot for a first time dog owner, but you are not. They generally make lovely family dogs and excel in just about anything you want to do with them. They are as good as you will get when it comes to allergies. Compared to similar large allergen-friendly breeds, they are considered to be the best family dogs in terms of temperament and energy needs.

The breeder you have described does not sound like they would be my first choice due to how puppies were chosen, but in general they are probably a reasonably decent breeder if they have titled their dogs in some venue and have completed OFA recommended health testing.

Perhaps you have cold feet because getting a puppy is a huge commitment and is guaranteed to cause stress and sleepless nights. I think most puppy owners feel that way when the date starts drawing near.

But if you do wholeheartedly want a dog, and you are prepared to deal with the stressful puppy stage, then I see no reason for turning back.

When I got my miniature poodle I had never previously met a well bred miniature poodle. I lived 12 hours from his breeder so the first time I saw him was when I picked him up. But I loved him from that moment and have never truly doubted that choice. I got him after over a year of desperately wanting a dog and there was no inkling of other emotion left in me.

I don't have advice because only you know what feelings are driving you to worry.

I will second Rose n Poos on minis though. Originally I wanted a small standard but I'm so glad I have a mini. Poodles are a lot of dog and I would not have been as happy with a bigger version. Misha is 16 lbs but most people guess he weighs much more. I took a video still showing him next to me. This is shaved down but he looks bigger when fluffy. He is 15" at the withers.

VideoCapture_20210406-210224.jpg
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter · #54 ·
@Raindrops i had no idea Misha was a mini!

I did reach out to them today based on what everyone recommended and they have no flexibility on the allergy issue at all, and made me feel crazy for asking. So if it doesn’t work out, I’m out the money. They said it’s a decision that I have to make. Quite an expensive gamble. And it is odd because it’s not like they couldn’t find another home for it immediately.

I guess maybe it’s all a sign. I’m having cold feet about a lot of things that probably could have been resolved if I had a better relationship with the breeder. I could have seen the dogs and if the breed was what I’m expecting and been able to assess his allergies somewhat. I don’t know if it would have been any different if I pushed earlier in the process. I guess I just was willing to trust that they would compromise with me if things didn’t work out.
 

·
Registered
Standard Poodle (arriving April 21st !!)
Joined
·
458 Posts
@Raindrops i had no idea Misha was a mini!

I did reach out to them today based on what everyone recommended and they have no flexibility on the allergy issue at all, and made me feel crazy for asking. So if it doesn’t work out, I’m out the money. They said it’s a decision that I have to make. Quite an expensive gamble. And it is odd because it’s not like they couldn’t find another home for it immediately.

I guess maybe it’s all a sign. I’m having cold feet about a lot of things that probably could have been resolved if I had a better relationship with the breeder. I could have seen the dogs and if the breed was what I’m expecting and been able to assess his allergies somewhat. I don’t know if it would have been any different if I pushed earlier in the process. I guess I just was willing to trust that they would compromise with me if things didn’t work out.
Unfortunately, that doesn't fit my category of a good breeder. Assuming a $500 deposit on a $2500 dog, I think I'd back out and call it a life lesson. So sorry it turned out this way.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter · #56 ·
Unfortunately, that doesn't fit my category of a good breeder. Assuming a $500 deposit on a $2500 dog, I think I'd back out and call it a life lesson. So sorry it turned out this way.
Now they are saying my deposit was my promise to purchase her? They can’t actually force me to pay the balance can they?? ($500 deposit, $3k total)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,100 Posts
I did reach out to them today based on what everyone recommended and they have no flexibility on the allergy issue at all, and made me feel crazy for asking. So if it doesn’t work out, I’m out the money. They said it’s a decision that I have to make. Quite an expensive gamble. And it is odd because it’s not like they couldn’t find another home for it immediately.
This whole thread has been so strange to me!
If I lived anywhere near you I would say " Bring your boys over! My Spoo would love them and they and you would absolutely love him! ". I so wish you lived here. There would have been absolutely no question in your mind that you would absolutely want a well bred Standard Poodle!!!

I think you have somehow allowed yourself to get a total wrong impression of poodles, probably from handlers/owners that did not raise and train their Standard Poodles in a loving yet superbly trained manner. But that is what you have chosen to do instead of look for loving examples.

You need to look at yourself. Why did you not go visit with poodles before you started this search? Why did you not take your children to go visit them? Why did you not become familiar with the breeder? Are you deliberately trying to fail? Sorry, I am 74 and am now straightforward in my remarks. Who knows how much time is left, I might as well say it the way I see it.

To me it was critical to get to know the breeder and her dogs, and after 11 years we still sometimes communicate! If you can't have a relationship with the breeder, what will you do if you need information?

And why are you being secretive on here? We are here to help you! But you do not even bother to tell us who the breeder is. There is absolutely no way any of the excellent trainers and owners on here can give you any advice with what you have told us. Mea Culpa
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,025 Posts
Now they are saying my deposit was my promise to purchase her? They can’t actually force me to pay the balance can they?? ($500 deposit, $3k total)
I don't see how they can demand the balance unless you signed something that agreed to pay the full amount whether you took the dog or not.

A deposit is generally considered a good faith indicator of being serious, but not to pay the full amount even if you don't take the dog. It's also a JIC to defray some of their costs if it takes additional time to get a new family I don't see how they can require you to pay the full amount, not ever have the dog, then sell the dog again for full price.

Originally, I'd felt that the Poodle Club reporting them "in good standing" was a good sign. Now I'm questioning if they're an actual member of The Poodle Club of (where you checked) or simply known to them and have no complaints on file.

I think I'd contact the Poodle Club again, not to complain, but to explain your situation and see if they feel the breeder is acting appropriately. Technically they may be within their rights but it sure doesn't sound like the pup's or the new family's welfare is their prime consideration. It's not as if you have prior experience dealing with a poodle breeder to understand all the variables.

Otherwise, you still have choices, even if not ideal.

You can move forward and take your pup home. Do this with an enthusiastic heart, hoping for the best, and knowing that PF will have your back. I wouldn't count on this breeder for that.

You can ask if the breeder will agree to apply your deposit to a next litter, giving you some time to prepare (not really holding out hope here).

Forfeit the deposit and move forward after being able to do some of these things, familiarize yourself with poodles as family members, and see how your son's allergies react.

If you try the first and still come to find that the pup just can't work in your family, contract to return with no refund notwithstanding, you may still have some options but that's a matter for a different thread too.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
93 Posts
Now they are saying my deposit was my promise to purchase her? They can’t actually force me to pay the balance can they?? ($500 deposit, $3k total)
If they don’t have it down in legal writing absolutely not. It is terrible that you can’t get your deposit back. I’m so sorry. I would back out now if I were you, and I would not pay them another dime. You owe them nothing, and they will still get plenty of money for the puppy from someone else.
 
41 - 60 of 82 Posts
Top