Poodle Forum banner

1 - 20 of 93 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
My dog is 3 years old and I got him around 2 years ago from a circle of abusers who didn't teach him anything right as a puppy. I was a first-time owner and realized that pads work better for me as I go to work and school during the day. His pads are in his puppy-proof room and I can swear he knows he has to go there. He in fact does it 96% of the time. I take him out 3 times a day for a couple of minutes to pee outside and still manage to find an accident at least once per month. It's somewhere new every time. This time it was on his favorite couch. It's almost like he does it despite knowing better. I heard of stuff like revenge pooping or boredom causing these accidents. Has anyone else experienced this stuff or has any advice for me? Something additional to know about him is he doesn't socialize much especially with corona around now and loves to bark at whoever passes by the house.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
4,456 Posts
Welcome! :)

I would go back to basics and treat your poodle like a puppy for a while. This is a great guide if you follow it carefully:


While there's no changing what's been done, dogs are resilient and thrive on routine and understanding what's expected of them.

You just need to do your part by letting go of ideas like "revenge soiling." Anxiety can manifest in inappropriate pottying. As can inadequate exercise and mental stimulation. Some dogs need activity to properly empty their bladder and bowels. Others confuse the soft texture of pads with other fabrics around the house. Or maybe he doesn't like going on pads that have already been soiled. There could be a number of things going on and it's not helpful to ascribe human motivations to dogs. It'll just make things worse for you both.

Are you working with a trainer? A rescue situation like this can challenge even experienced dog owners and could really benefit from someone savvy with positive reinforcement methods. I'd consider reaching out for some local help if you haven't already.

Please do also share a photo or two and tell us your little guy's name. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Welcome! :)

I would go back to basics and treat your poodle like a puppy for a while. This is a great guide if you follow it carefully:


While there's no changing what's been done, dogs are resilient and thrive on routine and understanding what's expected of them.

You just need to do your part by letting go of ideas like "revenge soiling." Anxiety can manifest in inappropriate pottying. As can inadequate exercise and mental stimulation. Some dogs need activity to properly empty their bladder and bowels. Others confuse the soft texture of pads with other fabrics around the house. Or maybe he doesn't like going on pads that have already been soiled. There could be a number of things going on and it's not helpful to ascribe human motivations to dogs. It'll just make things worse for you both.

Are you working with a trainer? A rescue situation like this can challenge even experienced dog owners and could really benefit from someone savvy with positive reinforcement methods. I'd consider reaching out for some local help if you haven't already.

Please do also share a photo or two and tell us your little guy's name. :)
Hello! Thank you for replying, I greatly appreciate your help. His name is Monday, I'll have a picture attached below. He is a lovely dog whom I love very much and wish I had him when he was first born. It didn't help that I was a first-time owner and found so many things that I did wrong/didn't do throughout the years. Unfortunately, I've tried online trainers but no one in person. It seems very hard to find trainers that would help me with potty pads as they are the most convenient for us. I have been wondering about getting him some grass pads but have been feeling conflicted about how I would go about cleaning them. Do you happen to have any advice on that?
monday pic.JPG
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,375 Posts
Cute little guy! Hopefully we can figure out some tips that will help. Does he like to mark outdoors? Many males will not fully empty their bladders unless they are taken for a bit of a walk. Mine pees about 10 times before he's starting to run empty. If he is a marker, that could be some of your problem. Not necessarily because he's marking indoors, but he could be peeing because he never really fully empties his bladder.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
3,153 Posts
I highly recommend using belly bands. I find this brand, JoyDaog, has a better fit and quality than others. The best fit ones come in a 3-pack and made of blue jean material, here.

Rinse out by hand with a little soap as needed, and since all of them attach using Velcro, so do NOT put in the dryer, and they last forever.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Cute little guy! Hopefully we can figure out some tips that will help. Does he like to mark outdoors? Many males will not fully empty their bladders unless they are taken for a bit of a walk. Mine pees about 10 times before he's starting to run empty. If he is a marker, that could be some of your problem. Not necessarily because he's marking indoors, but he could be peeing because he never really fully empties his bladder.
He LOVES marking outdoors. Do you think that problem also translates to pads though?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
I highly recommend using belly bands. I find this brand, JoyDaog, has a better fit and quality than others. The best fit ones come in a 3-pack and made of blue jean material, here.

Rinse out by hand with a little soap as needed, and since all of them attach using Velcro, so do NOT put in the dryer, and they last forever.
Hello, thank you for your reply. I'm glad to have come across these products for future reference but I was also looking for more long term solutions to his problems :(
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,375 Posts
He LOVES marking outdoors. Do you think that problem also translates to pads though?
Well it's just speculation here, but I know mine will avoid peeing in our yard because he prefers to pee out on a walk. And I always walk him until he's run out of pee even if it's just a quick potty walk. Mine can easily hold his pee for 12-15 hours if he wants to. I've actually never seen him "need to pee" since he gained bladder control at 6 months old. It's more of a fun recreational activity for him. I know potty pads can seem convenient, but you might see significant improvement if you can just take him on at least one good length walk to the point where his bladder is clearly running on empty. It's also nice for them to have some time out for mental stimulation. Mine empties his bladder within 10 minutes, though I try to give him a lot more than that because he has loads of energy. I don't know about where you live, but we're still fine to walk dogs here. In fact I think the dogs are getting way more walks than normal because people are so bored. People just stay 6 ft from eachother. If you can, my advice would be to try taking him out on a 15-20 minute walk twice a day, and see if that helps. It may take some time, and it may be easier after corona.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
Well it's just speculation here, but I know mine will avoid peeing in our yard because he prefers to pee out on a walk. And I always walk him until he's run out of pee even if it's just a quick potty walk. Mine can easily hold his pee for 12-15 hours if he wants to. I've actually never seen him "need to pee" since he gained bladder control at 6 months old. It's more of a fun recreational activity for him. I know potty pads can seem convenient, but you might see significant improvement if you can just take him on at least one good length walk to the point where his bladder is clearly running on empty. It's also nice for them to have some time out for mental stimulation. Mine empties his bladder within 10 minutes, though I try to give him a lot more than that because he has loads of energy. I don't know about where you live, but we're still fine to walk dogs here. In fact I think the dogs are getting way more walks than normal because people are so bored. People just stay 6 ft from eachother. If you can, my advice would be to try taking him out on a 15-20 minute walk twice a day, and see if that helps. It may take some time, and it may be easier after corona.
thank you for your advice! I'll see about walking him more throughout the day, I suspect he might be stressed out because of staying home all day too. I would have loved to get him off his pads but I know that once school starts again, I won't be having as much time as he deserves.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,736 Posts
Like all dogs who were raised in less than perfect conditions, to your dog, soiling inside is imprinted in his brain. And now that he’s been doing it for 2 years, it’s become a habit.

The fact that you have him on pipi pads is certainly adding to the confusion. And since you’re not home to correct the behavior, it will not go away on it’s own. Dogs that had a bad start need very disciplined actions from their owners and a lot of time and patience. But it can be done. My male toy was doing his business in a crate and marking in the house for 16 months before I got him. It took me about 1 1/2 years to make him reliable but today he is very very good. My female toy had a weak bladder and she was also very hard to train. I’ve had multitude of hard to train dogs, all small, but I’ve always succeeded and so can you.

Here’s what I would do. Get rid of all pipi pads and thoroughly clean the house with a mixture of vinegar/water (no bleach) or a commercial product if you prefer (the vinegar mixture works fine). Before, male sure to get half a dozen belly bands, they will be essential to your training.

Make sure you start on the week-end or when you are home, to correct any behavior. Start a routine for going outside, about 4 times a day. Don’t walk him to potty if you don’t want to have to do this for the rest of your life. I make my dogs go potty before walking them. After he’s done his business, put the belly band on him and leave it on. Only take the belly band off at night, and only if you can watch him.

A small dog can hold it just as long as a bigger one. If you work very long hours, have someone let him out once mid-day.

Since the behavior has been going on for a very long time, expect this whole process to last about 1 year. Maybe more, maybe a little less. This means wearing belly bands for the whole year. After six months without accident, you can start taking the belly band off a little at a time. Always be aware he might revert back, so test him before you allow more liberty.

It can be done and it will work, but it will take time. You can’t change an old habit in 3 weeks.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
4,456 Posts
Hello! Thank you for replying, I greatly appreciate your help. His name is Monday, I'll have a picture attached below. He is a lovely dog whom I love very much and wish I had him when he was first born. It didn't help that I was a first-time owner and found so many things that I did wrong/didn't do throughout the years. Unfortunately, I've tried online trainers but no one in person. It seems very hard to find trainers that would help me with potty pads as they are the most convenient for us. I have been wondering about getting him some grass pads but have been feeling conflicted about how I would go about cleaning them. Do you happen to have any advice on that? View attachment 465564
He's so cute!

A good trainer can help you diagnose the problem and can also help you work on some of your other concerns, like the barking. But reading that book I linked for you would be an excellent start. It addresses indoor pottying during long-term confinement.

Assuming Monday's physical and mental needs are being met, a return to basics could be all he needs.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Like all dogs who were raised in less than perfect conditions, to your dog, soiling inside is imprinted in his brain. And now that he’s been doing it for 2 years, it’s become a habit.

The fact that you have him on pipi pads is certainly adding to the confusion. And since you’re not home to correct the behavior, it will not go away on it’s own. Dogs that had a bad start need very disciplined actions from their owners and a lot of time and patience. But it can be done. My male toy was doing his business in a crate and marking in the house for 16 months before I got him. It took me about 1 1/2 years to make him reliable but today he is very very good. My female toy had a weak bladder and she was also very hard to train. I’ve had multitude of hard to train dogs, all small, but I’ve always succeeded and so can you.

Here’s what I would do. Get rid of all pipi pads and thoroughly clean the house with a mixture of vinegar/water (no bleach) or a commercial product if you prefer (the vinegar mixture works fine). Before, male sure to get half a dozen belly bands, they will be essential to your training.

Make sure you start on the week-end or when you are home, to correct any behavior. Start a routine for going outside, about 4 times a day. Don’t walk him to potty if you don’t want to have to do this for the rest of your life. I make my dogs go potty before walking them. After he’s done his business, put the belly band on him and leave it on. Only take the belly band off at night, and only if you can watch him.

A small dog can hold it just as long as a bigger one. If you work very long hours, have someone let him out once mid-day.

Since the behavior has been going on for a very long time, expect this whole process to last about 1 year. Maybe more, maybe a little less. This means wearing belly bands for the whole year. After six months without accident, you can start taking the belly band off a little at a time. Always be aware he might revert back, so test him before you allow more liberty.

It can be done and it will work, but it will take time. You can’t change an old habit in 3 weeks.
Thank you so much for that input! How do the belly bands work? How often do you wash them and how many at hand should I have? he can wear them all day (except when he walks? so thats 4 changes a day?) and are they good for both number 1 and 2? I know that's a lot of questions but I'm pretty new them, sorry haha. And how do I measure accidents after 6 months if he has been wearing the belly bands? what is the procedure for when he is left alone?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,736 Posts
Thank you so much for that input! How do the belly bands work? How often do you wash them and how many at hand should I have? he can wear them all day (except when he walks? so thats 4 changes a day?) and are they good for both number 1 and 2? I know that's a lot of questions but I'm pretty new them, sorry haha. And how do I measure accidents after 6 months if he has been wearing the belly bands? what is the procedure for when he is left alone?
You’re welcome. The best belly bands are the ones with a velcro on, so you just wrap it around the waist, making sure it sits over the penis. My dog never, ever peed in his belly band, and he wore them for more than a year. I guess it felt unnatural. And if he does pee, he will feel wet and uncomfortable so I suppose he will learn fast not to do it. I don’t know if other dogs pee in them but mine never did. Washing once a week is good then.

Your dog can wear them when you’re gone and pretty much all day, except at night I would give a break (but crate him or make him sleep with you so you can watch) and when he is outside. Check often, especially at first. He should have no visible marks or redness, even after wearing it all day.

Don’t buy too many until you’ve found the model that fits well on tour dog. I would say start with a pack of 3 or 6. If he doesn’t pee in them it will be more than enough. My favorites looked like these PETSWEARE Male Dog Diaper - Reusable and Washable - Soft & Comfortable - A Set of 3 PCS (Medium, Scottish, Black, Grey): Amazon.ca: Pet Supplies

As for accidents, as I said in my previous post, after a few months of controlling him and having 100% success rate, you will start testing him by allowing short periods without the belly band, but only when you can watch him closely. Start with 20 minutes, then very slowly increase. Do it at different moments of the day, but always after he has emptied his bladder. Set him up for success, not failure. After he has proven to be reliable on those tests for months (I like 6 months), then you can take the belly bands off. This should be about 1 year away. Make sure he is ready, because if he has even one accident, he goes back on the belly bands and you start over.

To my knowledge there are no anti-poop bands. But this is a lot easier to fix than urinating. Just feed once a day snd take the dog out at regular hours.

To help you achieve success, it is best to pair the belly band approach to a good housebreaking program. Treat him as if he was a puppy. I think other members gave you links for that. If not, there are many posts about it on the forum. It’s a new start, with a tool to help you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
You’re welcome. The best belly bands are the ones with a velcro on, so you just wrap it around the waist, making sure it sits over the penis. My dog never, ever peed in his belly band, and he wore them for more than a year. I guess it felt unnatural. And if he does pee, he will feel wet and uncomfortable so I suppose he will learn fast not to do it. I don’t know if other dogs pee in them but mine never did. Washing once a week is good then.

Your dog can wear them when you’re gone and pretty much all day, except at night I would give a break (but crate him or make him sleep with you so you can watch) and when he is outside. Check often, especially at first. He should have no visible marks or redness, even after wearing it all day.

Don’t buy too many until you’ve found the model that fits well on tour dog. I would say start with a pack of 3 or 6. If he doesn’t pee in them it will be more than enough. My favorites looked like these PETSWEARE Male Dog Diaper - Reusable and Washable - Soft & Comfortable - A Set of 3 PCS (Medium, Scottish, Black, Grey): Amazon.ca: Pet Supplies

As for accidents, as I said in my previous post, after a few months of controlling him and having 100% success rate, you will start testing him by allowing short periods without the belly band, but only when you can watch him closely. Start with 20 minutes, then very slowly increase. Do it at different moments of the day, but always after he has emptied his bladder. Set him up for success, not failure. After he has proven to be reliable on those tests for months (I like 6 months), then you can take the belly bands off. This should be about 1 year away. Make sure he is ready, because if he has even one accident, he goes back on the belly bands and you start over.

To my knowledge there are no anti-poop bands. But this is a lot easier to fix than urinating. Just feed once a day snd take the dog out at regular hours.

To help you achieve success, it is best to pair the belly band approach to a good housebreaking program. Treat him as if he was a puppy. I think other members gave you links for that. If not, there are many posts about it on the forum. It’s a new start, with a tool to help you.
I have ordered the bands now. I'm concerned with how this will play out once I'm away for long hours again but I'm willing to try something different! As for the vinegar mix you mentioned, how many parts water and vinegar did you find to be effective? Thank you so much thus far
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,375 Posts
I have ordered the bands now. I'm concerned with how this will play out once I'm away for long hours again but I'm willing to try something different! As for the vinegar mix you mentioned, how many parts water and vinegar did you find to be effective? Thank you so much thus far
How many hours are you typically away for? It's quite likely that he will be perfectly fine without a potty break.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,736 Posts
As for the vinegar mix you mentioned, how many parts water and vinegar did you find to be effective? Thank you so much thus far
I always did it approximately but I looked online and they say 1 part vinegar with 1 part water. So half and half.

Gwt him used to the belly bands before you start leaving him alone, so he knows that when you take them off, it’s time to pee. Once he’s done this association, it will be easier for him. It’s important that he associations belly bands = no pee but he also needs to trust that you are coming back to let him relieve himself.

The first thing you do when you come back home : take him outside then take off the belly band and let him relieve himself. Do not take the belly band off inside, as he might just relieve himself on the spot, in the house.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,736 Posts
I have ordered the bands now.
You probably did but just in case, make sure you bought the right size for your boy. I think mine was wearing small, but they should have a sizing chart to help you choose.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
You probably did but just in case, make sure you bought the right size for your boy. I think mine was wearing small, but they should have a sizing chart to help you choose.
Hello! I bought a size small for my toy poodle. I hope it fits right. It'll be arriving Monday so I've started the new potty program already
 
1 - 20 of 93 Posts
Top