Poodle Forum banner
1 - 14 of 14 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello again all,

Allow me to preface by saying that I have never dealt with a breeder of any kind for acquisition of a new puppy, all previous dogs have been rescues so I'm not sure what or how much to expect out of a breeder.

I wanted some general ideas on how quickly a breeder should typically respond to inquiries. I have two breeders in mind for a future Mini Poodle, my primary is local to me while the other is a few states away. My secondary choice got back to me via Facebook in a few days to a week. My primary choice however has not been very responsive.

I have sent a general inquiry email back at the end of July, as well as privately messaged them on both Facebook and Instagram. I received a response to my Facebook message after about 2 weeks at which point I asked about general pricing for a puppy and have heard nothing since. It has been about 2 weeks since that message and neither my email nor Instagram message have been responded to yet. I have also put in a formal application about mid-August in hopes for a quicker response, which has unfortunately not happened.

My greatest issue with this is that it seems any message I send asking about pricing is seemingly being ignored. Now this could very well just be my own mind skewing the events, but I cannot find any pricing information from this breeder and do have a budget I need to stay within. My second fear is if they are being this coy about the pricing of their dogs, then how responsive are they going to be about getting all the proper registration and health paperwork to me should I choose them?

This breeder comes recommended via other posts I've read and general reviews say they are very responsive, but I've not seen this. This makes me wary when I could be spending quite a bit of money. While I do understand that people have lives to live and may be busy, the breeders Instagram and Facebook are updated regularly.

The whole ordeal has me greatly discouraged and honestly frustrated as now my second choice breeder has closed applications for what I am looking for. Other inquiries to other breeders have all been responded to anywhere within days to weeks.

Am I expecting too much out of this breeder? Or is this something I should be taking to heart?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,589 Posts
Just curious... what's your budget?

I'm not sure where your mindset is, but shopping for a poodle isn't like shopping for a car. The upfront cost to a breeder isn't where you want to nickle-and-dime, and perhaps why leading with price is giving you the communication result that you're seeing.
 

·
Registered
Evelyn, sable standard poodle
Joined
·
237 Posts
Could be any number of things. From what I understand some breeders get a large volume of inquiries that ultimately amount to nothing. It may be that your approach was similar to that sort of inquirer. As you don't go into any detail about what you asked or said to the breeder I can't speak to whether it was the nature of your message or not. To some breeders the price should be the least important thing that a prospective buyer should want to know about their program. While definitely important, if the sum of your inquiry was "when will puppies be available?" and "what is the price?" it wouldn't be surprising if a breeder focused instead on those who seem more invested in their specific program and whatever makes them special. Its a seller's market for puppies right now and potential buyers are a dime a dozen and as flighty as mayflies. It's easy to get lost in the shuffle.

Frankly what you described above doesn't seem any more dismissive than what I've experienced with some rescue orgs. From what I understand persistence and creativity can pay off with rescues, but I wasn't willing to do that song and dance. But that doesn't mean that those they select get short shrift.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,099 Posts
I wanted some general ideas on how quickly a breeder should typically respond to inquiries. I have two breeders in mind for a future Mini Poodle, my primary is local to me while the other is a few states away. My secondary choice got back to me via Facebook in a few days to a week. My primary choice however has not been very responsive.
Since selecting a puppy thru a quality, conscientious breeder is a new experience to you, the first thing I'm going to do is offer a quote from cowpony.
It's understandable to think of these kinds of breeders as running a business but making money is definitely not their goal.
Buying from a good breeder is more like buying a '67 Corvette from an enthusiast at a car show. They are in the business because they like the showing and the tinkering, not because they love sales. You are buying the object of their affection, not a product. They put a lot of work into to that baby, and they want it to go to someone who loves it like they do.
While you're "interviewing" them, so they're interviewing you. Your approach is everything to them. What good things have you heard about them, their reputation, their poodles? Why do you want a poodle, their poodle?

You'll eventually go home with a beautiful, well bred poodle, that they lost sleep over, loved, and cried happy tears over when they know they've chosen the right family for their babies. They'll hope you stay in touch with them, and will offer support to you thru that pup's whole life.

How quickly they respond is dependent on so many things. They may have a new litter that requires their attention, they may be out participating in competitions, along with running their family, and their 9-5 job.

They may have been surprised by businesslike questions coming up before they've had a chance to get to know you.

Of course, pricing needs to be discussed, but not too soon. It might be helpful for you to know to expect to pay anywhere from $2500-$3500 USD, possibly a bit under or over. That's the range for conscientious breeders of quality, well bred pups.

These breeders will know the pedigrees of their lines and those of the other breeders. They will be thoughtfully pairing that dam and sire to improve health, improve a fault, strengthen good points including temperament. The dam and sire will be health tested per the Poodle Club of America standards. That means to OFA/CHIC recommendations to reduce known health issues.

how responsive are they going to be about getting all the proper registration and health paperwork to me should I choose them?
If they are a quality breeder, they will keep their word. Different breeders will have different requirements as to paperwork.

Re any health care records provided for the puppies, that should be in your hands or your vets before you finalize your contract.

Re health testing of the parents, that's usually freely published and open to the public on the OFA website. All you need is the dam/sire's AKC registry number or registry name and you can find that yourself.
Other health testing, usually genetic testing thru an independent lab such as PawPrints or Embark may be publicly available if the breeder chooses to. I would ask for access or the dam/sires names to see the info for yourself but genetic testing is more of a companion testing to the OFA/CHIC testing. It's not a replacement.

Re AKC registration for the puppies, that might be handled in one of two ways. If a spay/neuter agreement is in the contract, and it's rare that it's not, the pup will be sold on a limited registration. This means that no breeding rights go along with that contract. (BTW, a breeder who sells full registration without retaining co-ownership is not one who cares what happens to their pups once they leave the breeders home. This is almost universal.)

Assuming limited registration, most will hand off the registration papers of the litter to be converted to individual and still limited registration with your name as the owner. A smaller number will not turn over the registration papers until the spay/neuter contract is fulfilled.

Don't hesitate to ask anything else you want to know.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
322 Posts
We certainly are very pleased with Poppy's breeder.
We made enquiries, wrote a comprehensive email - our history with dogs, our lifestyle, our living conditions - environment, and why a Poodle was our choice of dog.
She explained that when we come to see the puppy not to be offended if she would not let us buy her.
Everything was in order, and we got the go ahead.
When we picked Poppy up we were there for over an hour getting imformation, going through her paperwork, ( which contained a wonderful welcome to your new home and family 'letter', with so much useful imformation ), Kennel Club registration, micro chip, vacination record, - also her favourite toys ( unbelievably her white bear and ratty have remained in pretty much one piece to this day)!
her bedding and food stuff ( but we know how thet turned out )!
Our dog trainer was very impressed when we said that our breeder had already used a cd with noises on - though being in England she said the gun shots were a bit out of place:):unsure:

After care and interest has been fantastic !
She is happy for us to call anytime when we are having a panic attack - and boy we have as you no doubt can appreciate - always giving great advice and comfort.
We often send her an update of Poppy's progress, and she says she loves seeing the pictures.
She has lent us her clippers, and actually shown us how to do stuff when we visited with Poppy. ( Strange visit in so far as Poppy's mum was not that keen on seeing Poppy).

To be fair our breeder lives just a 15 minuite drive away, so that may reflect some elements of 'aftercare', but is a great bonus.

Ha! In all the excitment we forgot to register Poppy under our name with the KC!
Our breeder did have to remind us of that!

One thing for sure a good breeder is essential, and any doubts about them should have you looking elsewhere.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Just curious... what's your budget?

I'm not sure where your mindset is, but shopping for a poodle isn't like shopping for a car. The upfront cost to a breeder isn't where you want to nickle-and-dime, and perhaps why leading with price is giving you the communication result that you're seeing.
I am willing to spend up to $3,000 as my absolute most, and that price would be a pup who ticks every box in terms of breeding and appearance. I am firm on wanting a female and am not willing to negotiate gender. Of this point I do completely understand that makes me pickier than the average potential buyer and may come off as a difficult client to a breeder.

I admit that I may be coming off as too business-like in my correspondence due to inexperience which very well may be my downfall as I’ve never had to “jump through hoops” with my previous dogs to show that we’d be a good home.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Since selecting a puppy thru a quality, conscientious breeder is a new experience to you, the first thing I'm going to do is offer a quote from cowpony.
It's understandable to think of these kinds of breeders as running a business but making money is definitely not their goal.

While you're "interviewing" them, so they're interviewing you. Your approach is everything to them. What good things have you heard about them, their reputation, their poodles? Why do you want a poodle, their poodle?


Don't hesitate to ask anything else you want to know.
Thank you very much for the advice and the input! My approach may have been too rushed, too businesslike as in my mind if the price isn’t in my ballpark, why pursue further you know?

What struck me as odd was that every other breeder has been very transparent with their prices which has helped eliminate some that are completely out of my range. As well as that the application hasn’t been responded to with neither an approval or a denial.

In my application I wrote the whole essay about our lifestyle and answered every question to the fullest of my ability figuring that since it’s on the application that is the information they want. As with a job application I’ve been cautious about follow up as I don’t want to come off as pushy or pestering.

As for cost it seems to be coming down to how badly do I want it? Which I suppose is the consensus for everything…

I’ve never thought about having to appeal to a breeder about the research I’ve done on them or the breed in general. I suppose since it’s just living in my head rent free, haha.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
3,565 Posts
I think, if you have submitted an application via their web form, it's reasonable to follow up with a brief email: "Hi, I'm so and so. I filled out your web form on August 1. I hadn't heard from you, so I wanted to make sure the submission hasn't been lost to a web glitch. I love your girl Bella and would love to know your breeding plans for her. "
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
386 Posts
I think its important to remember that most responsible breeders are not businesses. Its not like contacting a costumer service center and indeed thats how I prefer it. They are dealing with the communications alongside their own work, family commitments and dog care. If a breeder doesnt respond for a couple of weeks they might just be on vacation.

With initial contact I dont stress too much. They are often just busy. After I recieve a reply then I like to schedule a call at a time which is convenient for both.
 

·
Registered
Spoo coming 8/21! Buddy, a 16 yo shepherd mix, Fleur a 1 yo cat
Joined
·
53 Posts
I recently bought our lovely spoo from a breeder that I had stalked online for years. I found great consolation in reading PF about breeders and responsiveness because it was driving me a little bit bananas. Many older threads on here mentioned all that some of the above posters mentioned about how busy they are, how they are not businesses (which is why a flashy website might be more of a warning sign than an outdated one), and how their priority is their animals, not to their email.
I had faith that our puppy would be ready but I kid you not- I flew to Texas to get our pup without a response in weeks- I had never even had an answer to how much she would cost!!! I was honestly worried the breeder wouldn't be home, or I wouldn't have a puppy. But she was like, I told you once (months ago) that you were 3rd on the list...... Once I arrived, it was obvious that her lifestyle on the farm with the dogs was not conducive to replying to all of my emails😅
I also think they have so many emails that don't pan out.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,099 Posts
I am firm on wanting a female and am not willing to negotiate gender. Of this point I do completely understand that makes me pickier than the average potential buyer and may come off as a difficult client to a breeder.
It might make it more difficult to meet your requirements but that's also exactly why the conscientious breeders ask for applications to be filled out and/or have several conversations/communications with you to establish this. That's neither picky nor difficult just takes more time for the right pup to come along. They aren't being ordered from inventory after all ;) .

They'll also want to know your lifestyle. Active?, not so much?, and whether you think you might want to engage in activities like earning Trick titles, Nose work, Barn humt, Agility, Therapy work, and more, with your pup.

These things help them find the pup with the best temperament to match you.

Price is always awkward to get into, since this isn't any sort of typical business transaction, but after a couple of communications, you and the breeder should start to get a feel for whether you want to pursue this relationship (because that's what it should be). Once you think the breeder is someone you want to work with, it's ok to say that you have a price range that you can work in.

Where pricing should never vary is for different colors - it costs no more to breed one color over another, or different "special" sizes, especially if they're using marketing terms like "teacup" "tiny toy", or "royal" "giant".
There are only three varieties recognized by the Poodle Club of America and the AKC/UKC purebred registries. That's Toy, Miniature, and Standard.
A breeder doing the above is using trend pricing which suggests profit is more their goal, rather than improving their own dogs or adding something of value to the breed for the future.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,800 Posts
I know for a fact that my dog's breeder does not respond to messages that simply ask prices. She said she gets about six a day and those that ask about prices tend to be price shopping and are not the homes she wants. It's understandable to care about pricing to be sure you can afford it, but I would not begin a conversation about it. I only talked about price after a lot of other discussion on whether it was a good match.

A gender preference isn't unusual.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,589 Posts
Just pay whatever to get your dream poodle.

We'll help your bottom line save $1000-$1200+/year on grooming by teaching you how to do it at home. The extra +/-$500 upfront on a poodle puppy is nothing over the long run... Hopefully you can see that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
74 Posts
My breeder is not technically inclined. She lost our application a couple of times. The website looked pretty, but the original application didn't go through.
It turns out her adult daughter does most of the technical things like take and update pictures. The website was only kind of kept up to date. I ended up calling. She had to go find the emails I sent.
I eventually figured out they both posted on FB and YouTube because it is easier to maintain. Even then, the daughter had to use her own YouTube account for the evaluation videos because her mom was having issues getting into the one they kept for their breeding and showing.
 
1 - 14 of 14 Posts
Top