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Discussion Starter #1
You see... Norman and Loki are polar opposites.l in many ways.
Norman was obsessed with me as a puppy and still is now and never wanted to be away from me. But when we slept, he wanted to be alone.
Loki is so independent and gets upset when I pick him up. He only listens to “come” when I have chicken. If I don’t, he runs. But when he’s sleepy, he’s a big cuddle bug. Also he only wants to play with me 5% of the time and the rest with Norman.
Not sure what to do. He seems to only be comforted by Norman ? Which is great. But is it wrong to worry that he has no bond towards me? He fights me when I pick him up sometimes, like wiggle work and nibbles on my fingers.
Is there anything I can do to help our relationship? It’s weird that he only wants me when he’s sleepy ... but when he’s awake he won’t come near me unless he needs something. Lol I feel needy!!! I’ve had him for over 2 weeks.
 

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Discussion Starter #2
Also I know some dogs don’t like to be picked up... but I feel like this is different ??
 

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Gosh. How long did it take me with Peggy? MONTHS. And even still some days are rocky. The puppy blues are a very real thing, and some dogs are better than others at worming their way into our hearts.

Loki's wiggling sounds like confidence, and confident pups (in my experience) can take a longer time to warm up to.

Plus, a two-dog household will inevitably have a different dynamic. And while every puppy is different, those differences are going to be highlighted by the direct comparison.

I think with time you'll come to appreciate Loki's uniqueness. Having a more independent boy sounds like a nice way to complement your existing bond with Norman. But maybe you could do some things, just the two of you, to help build that connection.
 

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I would do lots of one-on-one training and bonding. Misha's also a very confident dog and his recall is a work in progress. He stays near me well, but he has a mind of his own. He is very attached to me, but he hates loss of control and is quite stubborn. He cuddled a lot as a little puppy but then stopped as he got bigger. But when he was about 9 months, he started slowly going back to cuddling. Now he is quite cuddly though he still likes some alone time periodically. I feel like bonding can be a very long process. It's natural to compare your new puppy to how Norman was, but remember that every dog is an individual and they mature differently.
 

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What do you do when he fights you when you pick him up? Don't put him down until he stops fighting and totally relaxes his body. He needs lots of time with you without Norman being present--separate walks, separate training time and play time with Norman not in the room. I would feed him separately by hand in a room apart from Norman. Limit his play time with Norman, and never call him to "come" unless you can enforce it, otherwise you are just teaching him that he doesn't have to come when he is called. Don't compare him to Norman, he is his own self. Find out who he is and appreciate his unique qualities.
 

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Don't put him down until he stops fighting and totally relaxes his body.
I think this is really important to do with all puppies, not in a "dominance" way, but to teach them early that being held by humans is okay. Just don't abuse it. Do it rarely and the moment he relaxes, release.

It took a couple of tries before Peggy really melted into it, but now I can hold her like a big baby. We also spent a lot of time holding yak cheese, bully sticks, and chew toys for her as a pup, while she lay in our laps. Very quickly she started bringing them over and climbing up onto us for a chew, and even now that she's too big to do that comfortably, she'll make sure she's touching us if possible.

I'm sharing these experiences because Peggy wasn't a cuddly, loungey pup. She was baffled by the couch and always wanted to lay on the floor. And then, after a few breakthrough moments, it was like a switch flipped, and now she's the cuddliest dog I've ever had. It's so nice to watch TV with a big poodle head in my lap. :)

Can I ask - You've mentioned a few times that Norman is protective of you, and since Loki's come home, you've said that he will stand between you during play. Is he guarding? If so, this could be making Loki worried about getting close.
 

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I think this is really important to do with all puppies, not in a "dominance" way, but to teach them early that being held by humans is okay. Just don't abuse it. Do it rarely and the moment he relaxes, release.

It took a couple of tries before Peggy really melted into it, but now I can hold her like a big baby. We also spent a lot of time holding yak cheese, bully sticks, and chew toys for her as a pup, while she lay in our laps. Very quickly she started bringing them over and climbing up onto us for a chew, and even now that she's too big to do that comfortably, she'll make sure she's touching us if possible.

I'm sharing these experiences because Peggy wasn't a cuddly, loungey pup. She was baffled by the couch and always wanted to lay on the floor. And then, after a few breakthrough moments, it was like a switch flipped, and now she's the cuddliest dog I've ever had. It's so nice to watch TV with a big poodle head in my lap. :)

Can I ask - You've mentioned a few times that Norman is protective of you, and since Loki's come home, you've said that he will stand between you during play. Is he guarding? If so, this could be making Loki worried about getting close.
yes Norman is protective of me but not in the sense of aggression. But you bring up a really great point that could easily be the reason why Loki is a bit apprehensive to connect with me. When I say that Norman is protective I mean because when Loki is playing rough with me or the other two dogs Norman always stands between the puppy and the other dogs. It’s a very interesting thing to see he always tries and takes the biting away from the other dogs or me and put it onto himself. I think that half of it has to do with not wanting us to feel the pain from the puppy and the other half is him one of the attention from Loki. but I do appreciate that point you brought up I think that that something I should work on and let Norman know that I’m OK even when the puppy is playing with me!!!!!
Thank you!!!!
 

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hi everyone! For some reason my phone is acting weird and it’s typing out my responses and duplicating it. So if this is duplicated my apologies. I just wanted to say thank you for your responses and I have started to hand feed him and give him one on one time in training. I think it’s going to really help out our relationship :) i’m going to finish up his room today to give him his own space to play and have fun with me one on one!!
Right now all it has is his kennel and a couple spare toys but I think that I’m going to take out a few pieces of furniture so he can have the full room by himself. But I also have my grooming equipment in there which makes it really Norman and Loki‘s room lol.

After hand feeding Loki yesterday he came up to me the living room sat down and asked for me to pet him for about five minutes which was really sweet.
Enjoy this cute little photo of Loki that I just took after typing this!!
image.jpg
 

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Our dogs can be so different. Bella was my first and she did not like being picked up and did not like to come when called, still doesn’t 😂. She only likes to cuddle on her own time but when she does she wants it for a long time, she even has naps in my lap. I don’t take it as a lack of a bond because she follows me every where, even if she was asleep when I moved away, she’s just finicky about being touched when she’s not in the mood and I just have to respect it.
Paris on the other hand is our new puppy and even though she loves playing by herself and with Bella she also loves when I pick her up. She’ll try to climb up my leg so I will and come beside our bed and bark so I know she’s there and I can pick her up. They’re all so different.
I think hand feeding treats is a great suggestion, as well as one on one time. Since he’s a puppy making yourself more interesting when you call him might help too. I have a little one line song for both our dogs when I call them. It’s fool proof with Paris and works most times with Bella so you could also try that.
Good luck! Loki is adorable.
 

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This is exactly what we are dealing with too! I'm glad to see it's not just that my puppy hates me We got Gypsy at almost 11 weeks and she's now almost 20 weeks. She doesn't like to be held or snuggled except on occasions when she is completely exhausted. Polar opposite of Piper (1.5yrs old) who bonded with me day one. We also got Piper out of a bad situation when she was 8 months old and I immediately became her person.

The thing with Gypsy is she's super independent, until I'm out of her sight (step outside, in the shower, if I get out of bed) then she whines to be held, but only for a moment then she's fighting to be put down to run again. She will run up to me on the couch but as soon as I touch her she takes off. When the other dogs are put up and it's just her she comes to me more. I think she's more bonded with Piper as her "person" than me. I'm still holding out hope that she comes to love me soon

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My boys weren't very cuddly for months, and I wasn't sure we'd ever have that bond. Somewhere after 5 or 6 months old they started choosing laps to lay on and legs to lie next to.

This is what my evenings look like most nights after I finally sit down. I'm typing this one handed because Remo hits my hand with his paw if I take it off of him :).

If they're not doing this with me, they're across on the other sofa with DH, or we get an even split with dealer trades happening and we look down to find a different poodle on or next to us.

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It kind of changed around with my guys. Pogo was originally more bonded to me than anyone else. He was extremely upset when I wasn't within arms reach. At the same time, he didn't 100% bond with me. He seemed distressed at losing his momdog, and it took him a while to adjust. After age 2, because I work longer hours and wasn't available, he shifted his allegiance to my husband. Now I'm definitely second best.

Snarky originally bonded with Pogo. He was less bothered by getting a new home, because he still had his brother. As Pogo and my husband got closer he shifted his allegiance to me.

At a bit over 3 months Galen is now more independent than either Snarky or Pogo were at his age. When we first got him he seemed completely undisturbed at being separated from his littermates and mom. He is unfazed when we disappear from his view in the yard. Initially he seemed to prefer humans as playmates. Now he seems to prefer Pogo for most games. (The exception is that game where he guesses some action to cause me to make a clicking noise and hand him a treat.) He is timid about walking off property when it's just him and a human, but he is quite bold when we bring Pogo along.I expect he will continue to go through moods and stages.
 
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