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Hello, I respectfully request permission to join this thread, for correspondence to the thread regarding Poodle Quest.
 

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Poodle Quest

I, and my husband Gary, are breeders of Registered Standard Poodles in Calgary, Alberta, with three Standards at present. We have a passion for this breed, and have worked with our Standards with autistic children, ADHD labelled children, and those with Downe Syndrome.

We love Standards, a truly 'life changing breed'! I teach courses on contracts from grades one to 12 in Speech, Sciences, Debate as well as a college level Political Science course. My husband is a Chiropractor, and we have four children ranging in age from 13 to 21; the eldest in University studying neuroscience.
 

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Welcome to you Poodle Quest.

Sounds like you have an amazing life. What a wonderful service you are providing for those who need the love of a poodle.
 

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Hi Poodle Quest,
I'm a fellow Canadian and I've been following the thread regarding your website, but haven't participated in it.
It must be very hurtful to find you've been the subject of criticisms, especially on such a public forum. There are some people here who seem to be out to discredit any other breeder they can find, but I don't think the ones who posted on this thread tend to be that way.
Once you have posted a website, you have opened yourself to other's opinions, both good and bad. My advice to you would be that you be sure that what you put on your website is well researched and correct. Some of your info on health and heredity is wrong, and this immediately gives the impression that you don't know what you're doing. It goes downhill from there.
Please don't come onto the forum with guns blazing (which is what I'd be inclined to do :)). There is a wealth of knowledge here and hopefully this can be a good, learning experience for all involved.
Vivienne
 

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Life is Good

Thank you for your kind response, life is good! We love horses as well, our youngest daughter rides a wonderful old retired race horse in the 4H club, and my husband adjusts (Chiropractic care) horses and dogs. Being around Standards and horses makes us better people.

I wanted to write you all; a family that we placed an adopted (rescued) Poodle with has kept me 'in the loop' on the threads on Poodle Quest for the past few days. She has herself quite stressed now; first on defending us, then on her avatar. Well, I can't speak on her behalf, though we all here care for her and her family, and wish she had not added to this forum. Though we placed this rescued poodle with her family, it is not a Poodle Quest puppy, yet we support it and her family as if it is one, for the life time of the Poodle. I did, however, want to write you myself, and thought it time to respond to comments written about us with Poodle Quest. We found constructive criticism, (though had to weed past some swear words to find it, as well as our own discomfort at being bumped at!) and made changes to our site. Thanks for 'heads up' where we could improve.

I don' know about the 'blithering' part suggested about our writing on the web pages, thats my stuff. I wordsmith for a living, it is just 'squirmy' to handle. So far, we have never heard that from anyone, and we take calls from everyone, anywhere, anytime, and offer any information we can give them on training, Poodle Care, etc. of our own time, we just love the Standard this much.

As to the diseases, we do mention them, on our 'Poodle Breed' and 'eat et al' pages. Don't agree that Bloat is an 'innate disease' to Standards, though.

Ah, the 'Ancient Breeding' term. Well, I did change the 50 gen to 'numerous'; this is based on our European breeding program; and we are heading to Germany this year for a new girl to breed to our two boys. 50 gen. refers to each dogs parentage, 25 on each side, separate from each other. We don't list our pedigees; just like puppies photos, we believe that these are personal to each new puppy owner. We are truly blessed when we can say that every litter is fully sold before our Dam whelps.

Integrity is only solid when it is clear. I hold integrity as a hallmark in my relationship wih God, my family, our Poodle families, and you, as critics.

I need to leave for a few hours, now; will check back later. I am sure I missed some of the remarks you all made, however, if you feel that more must be questioned, I am both open and welcome you to do so.
 

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Welcome.

Thank you for coming here to clarify a few things.

RE pedigrees.... So are you saying that your dam and sire are separated by 25 unique generations and that there are no dog/bitches repeated in the pedigree? Is this on past breedings or only on the up coming breeding with the new German bitch? Could you please share the registered names of your dam and sire?

RE Bloat.... Bloat is a very serious disorder in Poodles. Current opinion amongst vets and fanciers is that there is absolutely a genetic component to Bloat. Those of us who study pedigrees have watched it bounce down through generations. Here are an abstract that you may find interesting:

...from "Longevity in the Standard Poodle"
by John B. Armstrong, Ph.D.
Department of Biology
University of Ottawa, Ottawa, Canada

Cause of Death

Cause of death was indicated for 355 of the dogs surveyed. The most frequent cause cited for the pre-1982 dogs was "old age" (42.7%), whereas cancer was the most common cause in the 1982-99 group (33.7%), with old age only being cited 9.1% of the time. Table 1 shows the incidence of the most common causes of death, treating "old age" deaths as unknown.
before 1982 1982-99
Addison's 2.8% 5.9%
Cancer 41.5% 37.1%
GDV (bloat) 20.8% 27.6%
Immune-mediated 0.9% 7.6%
Kidney failure 5.7% 8.2%
Seizures 5.7% 1.2%
Cardiovascular* 6.5% 3.5%
All other 16.1% 16.5%
* includes stroke
Bloat kills about 30% of the affected dogs (Jan. 1998 Bloat Notes, Fig. 3). That would mean that the risk of a Standard Poodle bloating at least once during its lifetime may be as high as 90%.

There is a very strong correlation between the incidence of bloat and inbreeding (Fig. 4). However, one should not conclude that a dog that has a low inbreeding coefficient is at no risk. The correlation may be due to the genetic predisposition to bloat being carried by those lines that have, in the past, practiced the closest inbreeding. If this predisposition is inherited as a dominant trait, only one parent need be a carrier.


Crud.... the forum won't format the table correctly. Sorry folks...
 

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I'm glad you arrived here. Since you are a wordsmith, it would behove you to use correct terms when discussing pedigrees.
I will repeat what I posted before:


I don't understand the concept of 50 generations between sire and dam. Generations are quantified in first, second, third, and so on. A sire and dam is the first generation on a dogs pedigree, the grandparents are the second. The concept you are talking about does not exist.
In 10 generations, there are 2046 available spaces for individual dogs in a pedigree. Usually there are an average of 700 unique dogs in 10 generations.
I know of one dog that has 1094 unique dogs out of 2046, there may be a few with more, I'd love to see those dogs.....

Even if you have changed your page to numerous- meaning 25 on each side, that really means almost 6 generations.
I applaud your quest to find diversity. When you do look at pedigrees, if you go back far enough, even in Germany, you will end at the same dogs.
One thing to do if you are interested, is to enter and send DNA to the PCC Health survey that Mary Jane Weir is spearheading.
I will make a separate post about that soon.
Carole
 

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I'm glad you arrived here. Since you are a wordsmith, it would behove you to use correct terms when discussing pedigrees.
I will repeat what I posted before:


I don't understand the concept of 50 generations between sire and dam. Generations are quantified in first, second, third, and so on. A sire and dam is the first generation on a dogs pedigree, the grandparents are the second. The concept you are talking about does not exist.
In 10 generations, there are 2046 available spaces for individual dogs in a pedigree. Usually there are an average of 700 unique dogs in 10 generations.
I know of one dog that has 1094 unique dogs out of 2046, there may be a few with more, I'd love to see those dogs.....

Even if you have changed your page to numerous- meaning 25 on each side, that really means almost 6 generations.
I applaud your quest to find diversity. When you do look at pedigrees, if you go back far enough, even in Germany, you will end at the same dogs.
One thing to do if you are interested, is to enter and send DNA to the PCC Health survey that Mary Jane Weir is spearheading.
I will make a separate post about that soon.
Carole
Hello Carole. Well, I appreciate your information, and did spend an hour this morning on telephone with Ann Belle, who is Chairman for the Breed Standard of Canada. I have submitted our information to her, and will continue to do so in all of our breed Standard testing, as well as our breeding program. She is good to disclose to, works with me and is kind. I trust her, and will continue to do so.

We are arranging to meet with Mary Jane Wier when she is in Calgary, as well.

Thank you again for your information.
Best to you all.
Christianne.
 
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