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Discussion Starter #1
Does anyone have any pictures of a poodle in a European-T clip? How does this clip differ from the Modern? They look the same to my uneducated eye. LOL :)

Also, what does the "T" stand for?

Thanks in advance! :D
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Hmm... Thanks Flyingduster.

I couldn't find anything on the net about this clip. No pics, no info, nothing.
It's in the Kalstone book I think, but some pictures labeled "modern" looked the same.

The pictures on the link you posted looked like scandinavian puppy lions to me... :wacko:

Now I'm even more confused.

:doh:
 

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lol, yeah I think it's more of a name someone came up with for a stylised trim of some description (be it a modern or a puppy lion; something that had neck hair and big hocks sorta thing) and no one really clarified it properly so it can mean different things...

But I have never seen it being referred to as anything other than a modern-type clip, or a puppy lion-type clip, so it's definitely something like that anyway... I'd ignore it totally to be honest and just go with one or the other, ignoring the 'T clip" bit entierly!!! lol
 

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Okay, I stared at the pictures in the Kalstone book until my eyes went fuzzy, and this is what I came up with:

The Lamb: Short(ish) body, leg hair is longer than the body hair and is blended into the body, big round topknot, may or may not have long crest hair. Pompom tail. Long ears. Overall lines are well blended and curvy. No sharp edges.

The Modern: Jazzed up and exaggerated version of the Lamb. Topknot is much bigger and higher, crest hair is big, leg hair is long, especially at bottom of legs, ears are long, tail is big. Just generally bigger and poofier than the lamb. Angles and edges are slightly sharper than the lamb to give "flair".

The Scandinavian Puppy Lion: Big jacket and tied topknot like the continental. Front legs are full cylindrical tubes that meet the jacket at the elbow. Hindquarters are trimmed tight and angular and the hair blends into the hind legs which are very full at the hocks. There is a distinct line separating the front and back halves of the dog made by the fullness of the jacket and the tightness of the hind. Tail is HUGE because I've only seen this clip on undocked poodles. LOL! (except for Paris!! :) )

The European-T Clip: I suddenly realized that this clip is basically a Scandinavian Puppy with a pet topknot (scissored vs tied). Which makes it look a lot like the Modern for the exception of the big jacket on the European-T, which the Modern does not have. The Euro-T has that distinct separation between the big front and short hind, just like the Scandinavian, while on the Modern, the hair on the chest is the same length as the hair on the bum. The legs and topknot are very similar, although the Euro-T is slightly more angular.

I still don't know what the "T" is for, though. :eek:hwell:
 

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CAMEO went to Ann Martins 2 day poodle seminar with my friend Amy "Bullet" Brown. Ann helped Amy put her poodle, Ruby, in the Scandinavian T trim but advised her NOT to compete with that trim because the judges aren't educated enough about it to judge it when going against german, continentals, saddles and lamb trims. Cameo, can you describe what Ruby looked like???
 

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CAMEO went to Ann Martins 2 day poodle seminar with my friend Amy "Bullet" Brown. Ann helped Amy put her poodle, Ruby, in the Scandinavian T trim but advised her NOT to compete with that trim because the judges aren't educated enough about it to judge it when going against german, continentals, saddles and lamb trims. Cameo, can you describe what Ruby looked like???

The way *I* understood it was, it's like doing a Continental (the Jacket part), with hair on the back side like the Euro Puppy. So you have the jacket, with the legs clearly defined set UNDER it and then clear definition between the jacket and the Euro puppy hind end with the very stylized back legs. Also, the front legs are set well UNDER the jacket with clear definition between them. Wish I could give you more information, but I had Cameo on the table as well and was wading thru a HUMONGUS amount of coat!

Bullet had her hands full doing that trim on Ruby. The coat was pretty soft and Bullet was working with a bandaged finger on her RIGHT hand! Ruby looked great considering!
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Cameo:

Oohhh! That must have been loads of fun!!!
Sorry for being thick headed but what do you mean by :

...the front legs are set well UNDER the jacket...
...as opposed to "over" the jacket? LOL!!! :laugh: I'm not quite sure what you're trying to say... this clip CONFUZZLES me!!! :wacko:
 

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Cameo:

Oohhh! That must have been loads of fun!!!
Sorry for being thick headed but what do you mean by :



...as opposed to "over" the jacket? LOL!!! :laugh: I'm not quite sure what you're trying to say... this clip CONFUZZLES me!!! :wacko:
The legs are to be separate from the jacket (not blended) and they are to be set up under, as if they are sticking out from under the jacket, like a continental, but with hair :) Hope that makes more sense, but it's hard to describe without the benefit of pictures, lol
 

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How does this clip differ from the Modern? They look the same to my uneducated eye. LOL :)

Also, what does the "T" stand for?

Thanks in advance! :D
here nobody say European T-Clip

here we say ´Scandinavian T-Clip or T-Clip and this is correctly in Europa.
The -T- stay for Terrier and I think it is
the modern Art from the German Karakul-Schur karakul-clip from the 50th. But spell it not english :)

Here the Original Karakul
http://www.sebastian-loetsch.at/pca/images/Karakul-Schnitt.jpg
So had my father cut our Poodle between 1950 until 1960
 

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here nobody say European T-Clip

here we say ´Scandinavian T-Clip or T-Clip and this is correctly in Europa.
The -T- stay for Terrier and I think it is
the modern Art from the German Karakul-Schur karakul-clip from the 50th. But spell it not english :)

Here the Original Karakul
http://www.sebastian-loetsch.at/pca/images/Karakul-Schnitt.jpg
So had my father cut our Poodle between 1950 until 1960
I had always imagined the karakul to be blended..... i definately like this!
 

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I have this Clip never see from the :afraid:
at the ? :angel: 60th

It is a historic clip and you kann not find Picures. Only this perfectly one in Germany from a old Book .

(Today it was storm with raining Ice- Stones like peas :ahhhhh: in Germany .)
 
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