[Nromley]

I've read through all the helpful threads about breeders here, and have looked at many breeder webpages.

I have a 13 year old male lab and a six year old female standard poodle. We are looking for a new puppy; I'd like to do agility, obedience or rally. My main concerns for a puppy are good health and great temperament. I don't really care about color or sex.

I am going to look at a four month old puppy next week at allniteparti poodles. Home

I have spoken with the owner who states she doesn't show because of the politics in conformation. But, I can't see where any of these dogs are participating in any type of obedience, rally, etc. Should this be a concern? Is four months too old?

She does have all the adult dog's pedigrees and genetic information listed on the webpage, but the parents of the puppies aren't listed, so I'd have to ask about the parents of the puppy I'm interested in.

I don't need a dog to compete in conformation, but I do need a good poodle! Are there any red flags here that you experts see? Should I pass and move onto a breeder who is actively showing or participating in other competitions? Also, I live in Maryland, but am willing to travel to pick up a puppy.

Thank you very much for your advice.

 

[Poodlebeguiled]

I'd steer clear of this breeder...doesn't look good to me.

Should I pass and move onto a breeder who is actively showing or participating in other competitions?

Yes.

There are some members here who may be able to help you find a reputable breeder near where you live. I live on the west coast so not familiar with over that way.

 

[Nromley]

Thank you very much. I went back and read through the webpage and while the dogs may be wonderful, the lack of information bothers me.
I am looking at Piccolo, which is just an hour or so away from me. I like all the information on their page and the look of their dogs.

A big difference in the info on their upcoming litter. Love all the information:
https://www.facebook.com/piccolospo...a8sXH8HCQpZPCeQys2DEQW14WDDj8LE1xA&__tn__=K-R

 

[Poodlebeguiled]

They appear to be good! Check it out further. Get references. Go see a show if you can...talk to people. See if you can make a visit. That's not far at all.

Here's another one I came across...you can't go strictly by websites so further investigating is always a good idea. Sometimes they look really good, have nice dogs and they turn out to be a huge scale breeder, bordering on puppy mill status. Or it turns out their lying. So get proof and references. So it's best if you can go visit them. Again, references. Ask about the longevity of some of the poodles in the lines of the litter you're looking at. (when the time comes) And what they died of. And proof of health testing. That first breeder did do some health testing it looked like but I didn't love the looks of her dogs that well. And all those colors, no titles or proof of their conformation, ability to do dog sports or anything else. I want to see breeders who adhere to the standard and have proof of good structure, temperament etc and that comes from conformation showing OR proof that the dog can run all day hunting, retrieving or some sport that represents those types of things...things the dog was bred to do. Are the dogs physically put together to do those things? And temperamentally sound to work along side their people.

http://www.marquisdiamondstandardpoodles.com/

 

[Johanna]

I would not recommend AllNite - it appears they do not do genetic testing.


Piccolo, on the other hand, is very good - appropriate testing and involvement in activities. I would certainly buy from Piccolo.

 

[Nromley]

Again, I appreciate the information. Just received an amazingly detailed email from Piccolo that I really liked. I will check out the link you provided. It is very helpful.

 

[Raindrops]

Thank you very much. I went back and read through the webpage and while the dogs may be wonderful, the lack of information bothers me.
I am looking at Piccolo, which is just an hour or so away from me. I like all the information on their page and the look of their dogs.

A big difference in the info on their upcoming litter. Love all the information:
https://www.facebook.com/piccolospo...a8sXH8HCQpZPCeQys2DEQW14WDDj8LE1xA&__tn__=K-R

From that post they look great. Sounds like they check all the boxes for responsible breeders and have a lot of performance titles in the lines.

 

[Nromley]

Thank you, Johanna and Raindrops. I always should pay attention when I feel there are red flags.
Some of what I received from Piccolo:

"We always select parent dogs that have strong performance and conformation backgrounds with excellent temperaments. All our dogs are fully health certified by the OFA, CERF, and CHIC for numerous orthopedic and genetic diseases by a multitude of tests and examinations so our puppies come from a healthy background. As a member of the Better Bred community, all our dogs have also been tested at the Veterinary Genetics Laboratory as part of the Canine Genetic Diversity project which helps breeders to improve the health of breeding programs. Greater genetic diversity reduces the likelihood of autoimmune and other diseases. All our dogs are family pets that live in our home. No dog is ever bred before the age of 2 years and completing all OFA, CERF, and CHIC health certifications. Our females only have 2-3 litters in their lifetime and are spayed when they retire from motherhood. All our dogs live out their full life with us as a loving member in our family home. We do not re-home our females after they retire from motherhood.



Our puppies are home born and family raised with lots of love and care in a smoke-free home. We raise our puppies using Puppy Culture which includes socializing protocols, emotional resilience exercises, problem solving, and environment enrichment. We expose puppies to early neurological stimulation protocol which helps puppies to able to cope with stressful situations, increase problem solving, and support better physical health later in life. We start litter box training at around 2.5 weeks of age which helps with house training. They are socialized and raised to become confident puppies by exposure to various noises/music, people, Adventure Box play, play tunnel, and different surfaces including hard wood floors, carpet, and outdoor grass. Our puppies are evaluated at 7 weeks old with the Volhard Puppy Aptitude Test and conformation structural evaluation which aids in pairing the right puppy with the right home. The Volhard test predicts inherited behavioral tendencies and how the puppy will turn out as an adult. All our puppies are current on vaccines, vet-checked, dewormed, dew claws removed, and have had their tail docked per AKC standards. Puppies start with regular nail trimming at a few days old, bathing/fluff drying at about 4 weeks old, and clipper groomed at about 5 weeks old. They experience the full grooming process several times so they get accustomed to it. As an added value to our puppies, we offer continued grooming sessions at our home on a 3-4 week schedule at $50/grooming until they can safely visit an outside grooming salon after completing their puppy vaccine series at 16 weeks old. This helps continue grooming training and keeps our puppies looking great while protecting their health. All our puppies come with a written 2-year genetic health guarantee for hip dysplasia, elbow dysplasia, ocular disease, congenital deafness, Von Willebrand's Disease, Neonatal Encephalopathy, and Degenerative Myelopathy. All our puppies also come with a commitment to lifetime support. We help with any questions or concerns over the years and keep in touch with the families of all our puppies. Puppies come with a written health guarantee, current health record, puppy pack, proof of parent genetic health testing, pedigree, supply of current puppy food, collar, play toy, towel scented with the litter, and a lifetime of breeder support.



The puppies come from an obedience, therapy, agility, hunting, and solid conformation background. All our dogs have earned titles in competitive AKC, UKC, and/or CDSP obedience and rally performance events. Our dogs also show in UKC conformation events to achieve their Championship title. Most of our dogs are Therapy Dog International certified. Most of our dogs have also earned the Versatility Certificate Award because of their performance achievements and our commitment to full health testing. Putting a title on a dog proves the animal is stable, intelligent, sociable, and can work in a stressful environment. Our puppies have a sound build, fantastic personalities, intelligence, and aim to please! In our upcoming litter’s 6-generation pedigree, there are almost 100 performance titles (obedience, Rally, agility, therapy, hunting, tracking, herding, versatility, etc) and 40 conformation Champions! The puppies will be excellent performance (obedience, Rally, agility, tracking), conformation, hunting, and therapy prospects as well as amazing pets!

The mother of our upcoming litter is URO3 CH Piccolo’s Gilded Paige RN RA TKN SN-C VCX CHIC (call name Paige). Attached is a photo collage of Paige. This will be her second litter, and she loves being a mother. She is very sweet with a high drive. She is a happy, enthusiastic worker. She is a natural retriever and loves tennis balls. She is solid brown in color and weighs 45 pounds. Paige is fully OFA, CERF, and CHIC health certified. She has tested normal by CERF for heritable eye disease and certified by the OFA for her hips, elbows, thyroid, and full dentition. She has been tested normal and clear for Von Willebrand's Disease, Neonatal Encephalopathy, Degenerative Myelopathy, and Brucellosis. Paige’s OFA health testing link is https://www.ofa.org/advanced-search?f=sr&appnum=1913764. Her CHIC health certification number is 124229. She has also been tested at the Veterinary Genetics Laboratory as part of the Canine Genetic Diversity project which helps breeders to improve the health of breeding programs. Paige’s mother Prada is CHIC certified and has tested normal by CERF for heritable eye disease and certified by the OFA for her hips, elbows, heart, and thyroid. She has tested normal and clear for Von Willebrand's Disease, Neonatal Encephalopathy, Degenerative Myelopathy, and Brucellosis. She has also been tested at the Veterinary Genetics Laboratory as part of the Canine Genetic Diversity project. Paige’s father Guinness is CHIC certified and has tested normal by CERF for heritable eye disease and certified by the OFA for his hips, elbows, heart, and thyroid. He has also been tested at the Veterinary Genetics Laboratory as part of the Canine Genetic Diversity project. Three of Paige’s grandparents are also fully OFA, CERF, and CHIC health certified.

In Paige’s 4-generation pedigree, there are over 40 performance titles and 11 Champions! Paige has earned her AKC RN and RA rally titles; AKC Novice Trick Dog title; UKC URO1, URO2, and URO3 rally title; UKC Championship title; and CDSP SN-C obedience title. Paige also has been awarded the Versatility Certificate Excellent Award for her performance in obedience, rally, and extensive health testing. Paige’s mother Prada has her AKC BN and CD obedience titles; AKC RN, RA, and RE rally titles; AKC Novice Trick Dog title; UKC URO1, URO2, and URO3 rally titles; UKC Championship title; CDSP CD-C obedience title; and Therapy Dog International certification. Prada also has been awarded the Versatility Certificate Award for her performance in obedience, rally, temperament, and extensive health testing. Paige’s father Guinness has his HIT herding title and UKC Championship title. Paige’s grandparents’ titles include 3 AKC CD obedience titles, 3 AKC RN rally titles, 2 AKC RA rally titles, AKC Novice Trick Dog title, UKC URO1 title, 2 CKC conformation Championship titles, HIT herding title, VC award, 2 VCX awards, and 2 certified therapy dogs.

 

[Raindrops]

It sounds like that litter is very promising, though you'll want to check into additional things. Some of the questions I would ask would be:

How are puppies paired with homes?
What vaccine protocol is followed?
What diet do you feed puppies and adults?

Hopefully they can also give you info on the sire.
The dewclaw removal and tail docking is mostly a personal preference thing, though some agility competitors will argue the benefits of leaving dewclaws in performance dogs. I only mention it as something to consider.

 

[Nromley]

They state:
Our puppies are home born and family raised with lots of love and care. They are socialized and raised to become confident puppies by exposure to various noises/music, people, Adventure Box play, play tunnel, and different surfaces including hard wood floors, carpet, and outdoor grass. We also expose puppies to early neurological stimulation protocol which helps puppies to able to cope with stressful situations, increase problem solving, and support better physical health later in life. Our puppies are evaluated at 7 weeks old with the Volhard Puppy Aptitude Test which aids in pairing the right puppy with the right home. All our puppies are current on vaccines, vet-checked, wormed, dew claws removed, and have had their tail docked per AKC standards. Puppies are bathed and fully groomed several times so they get accustomed to the process. Puppies come with a current health record, puppy pack, proof of parent genetic health testing, pedigree, supply of current puppy food, collar, play toy, and a lifetime of breeder support. We adhere to the Poodle Club of America Breeder Code of Ethics.

They allow buyers to choose, in the order of their deposit, but they have the final say if it's not a good fit.

Good questions, I will ask them for details. I have never chosen my dog, always make sure the breeder knows what I'm looking for, and they choose. It's worked out better for me that way.

Info on the sire:
The sire is CH UGRCH UROC UCD UAGII Jed's e e cummings Colando VCD2 BN CDX JH RAE2 RM THD WCX CGC (CKC) TD UTDX RE CD (call name Estlin). He is fully OFA, CERF, and CHIC health certified and has tested normal and clear for eye, hips, elbows, cardiac, Von Willebrand's Disease, and Neonatal Encephalopathy. Estlin’s OFA health link is https://www.ofa.org/advanced-search?f=sr&appnum=1619602. He is a very accomplished dog with an amazing temperament! Estlin has earned his AKC Championship title; AKC BN, CD, and CDX obedience titles; AKC OA, OJ, NA, and NJ agility titles; AKC RN, RA, RE, and RAE2 rally titles; AKC TD tracking title; AKC VCD2 versatility title; AKC JH hunting title; AKC THDN and THD therapy dog title; AKC WC and WCX working titles; AKC CGC title; UKC Grand Champion title; UKC CD obedience title; UKC URO1, URO2, and URO3 rally titles; UKC UAGI and UAGII agility titles; and CKC CD obedience title; CKC RN, RA, and RE rally titles; CKC TD and UTD tracking titles. His mother comes from an accomplished hunting line.

 

[peppersb]

The info that you received from Piccolo sounds fabulous. Love the fact that they keep their poodles after they are retired. Sounds like the poodles are well-loved and I think that a well-loved momma dog passes happy confidence on to her babies. Piccolo sounds like they are wonderful breeders. Only concern that I would have is that they say that the mother has a high drive. Hunting lines are also likely to be high prey drive. Poodles that have a high drive tend to need a lot of activities and hours of daily exercise. You should make sure that that is a good fit for you and your family.

Best of luck to you.

 

[lily cd re]

I believe mvhplank's spoo Nealy is a Piccolo dog. If I am correct on that there are two things you should know. First is that he is a very accomplished rally and obedience dog. Second is that he has mild Addison's.


I have to take exception to the notion that a high drive/working line type personality needs hours of being run about. What that sort of dog needs is lots of thinking brain drain work. Both of my high drive spoos are sound asleep near me right now because they each had training time this morning.


I have two additional suggestions in the northeast that you might want to consider. First, in Connecticut my boy Javelin's breeders Delana and Mark Severs (Madela poodles) and second Linda Hamilton in New Jersey at Scheherazade poodles.

 

[Nromley]

Thank you, peppersb. Those are good things to think about.

Lily cd re - thank you for the additional suggestions. How do I find out about Addisons? Is there something in the health history to look for? Or, just ask the breeder?

 

[lily cd re]

I would ask the breeder, but you can also look for whether the parents have any history in the poodle health registry records. Unfortunately there isn't a genetic test for it.

 

[Viking Queen]

Thank you very much. I went back and read through the webpage and while the dogs may be wonderful, the lack of information bothers me.
I am looking at Piccolo, which is just an hour or so away from me. I like all the information on their page and the look of their dogs.

A big difference in the info on their upcoming litter. Love all the information:
https://www.facebook.com/piccolospo...a8sXH8HCQpZPCeQys2DEQW14WDDj8LE1xA&__tn__=K-R

Hello,

I have a friend here in Colorado with a 3 yr old standard from Piccolo and he is lovely. My friend and her family are so happy with their boy, Kip! She and I previously had siblings from another breeder so I know how thorough she is in selecting breeders. Good luck with your search!

Cathy

 

[Nromley]

Thank you. I am also looking at a couple of mini breeders. Decisions, decisions.

 

[BabetteH]

Sounds like you already have a few great contacts.

From my recent search in Germany, I'd like to add that a lot of breeders don't have a website or even email. The official registry keeps a list of expected litters and you have to call the breeders to find out more. The breeders have no problems finding enough buyers, so they don't go through the hassle of setting up a website and keeping it up to date.

My gut feeling tells me to stay away from a breeder where the website is too shiny, I'd rather have them spend their time on the puppies than at the computer.

 

[peppersb]

Sounds like you already have a few great contacts.

From my recent search in Germany, I'd like to add that a lot of breeders don't have a website or even email. The official registry keeps a list of expected litters and you have to call the breeders to find out more. The breeders have no problems finding enough buyers, so they don't go through the hassle of setting up a website and keeping it up to date.

My gut feeling tells me to stay away from a breeder where the website is too shiny, I'd rather have them spend their time on the puppies than at the computer.

Good point. The breeder who is using my boy Sam in her breeding program (New Destiny Poodles) has not bothered to update her web site. She had no trouble finding homes for her spring 2019 litter. Most of the pups were sold by word of mouth, with buyers identified before the pups were born.