Poodle Forum banner

1 - 17 of 17 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
29 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi guys (gender inclusive), I was just on the phone with the breeder from whom I will be getting my standard poodle pup in a few months. (Litter is due at the end of this month) and I was asking her advice about harnesses and sizing and she basically said that until I'm specifically doing training related to service work, that I really don't need a harness, that all of my basic obedience and walking training would be done with a slip collar. I was a little surprised at this and probably sounded like an idiot when I said "you mean like what the vet puts on them?" and she said it doesn't need to have the leash attached but yes. I again tried to clarify, "you mean a choker?" I have been obsessively watching a few trainers on YouTube who use positive reinforcement methods, clicker training etc and none of them use choker type collars. Now I am so confused. Advice please.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,027 Posts
Breeders, the good ones are showing dogs in conformation, spend a lot of time protecting coat. I have often used a slip collar like white pine outfitters sells in order to reduce the coat friction around my poodle's neck. I recently bought a roll collar (closes with a buckle) that is also supposed to reduced the wear and tear on the coat. At home a lot of poodle people, especially show people, do not use a collar at all. Microchip your dog!

Martingales are often used in training. "Choke" collars are often used when running around a conformation ring because it has least impact on the hairstyle.

For a poodle kept in a very short clip a flat buckle collar is perfectly fine. However many people like some fluff around the neck and then buckle collars become a coat issue.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
29 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Breeders, the good ones are showing dogs in conformation, spend a lot of time protecting coat. I have often used a slip collar like white pine outfitters sells in order to reduce the coat friction around my poodle's neck. I recently bought a roll collar (closes with a buckle) that is also supposed to reduced the wear and tear on the coat. At home a lot of poodle people, especially show people, do not use a collar at all. Microchip your dog!

Martingales are often used in training. "Choke" collars are often used when running around a conformation ring because it has least impact on the hairstyle.

For a poodle kept in a very short clip a flat buckle collar is perfectly fine. However many people like some fluff around the neck and then buckle collars become a coat issue.
Thank you for the explanation. My puppy will be a service dog and will be kept in a short clipped style.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
2,773 Posts
I think a lot of show breeders don't like harnesses, as harnesses rub the hair, cause mats, and in general do bad things to a show coat. Additionally, slip chains are commonly used in the show ring, so any show dog needs to be used to them.

Not being a show dog owner, I prefer to use a harness on tiny puppies. I think a harness provides more protection for tiny developing necks while the puppy learns leash manners. Once the puppy gets older I may start using a martingale.

A martingale is like a cross between a slip collar and a flat collar. It has a chain connecting two rings on the end of the flat pieces. Unlike a slip collar, a properly adjusted martingale can't tighten enough to choke the dog. Unlike a flat collar, the dog can't drop his head and pop out of it. The martingale sits comfortably loose on the neck until the dog starts pulling, at which point it tightens to its set point.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
29 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I think a lot of show breeders don't like harnesses, as harnesses rub the hair, cause mats, and in general do bad things to a show coat. Additionally, slip chains are commonly used in the show ring, so any show dog needs to be used to them.

Not being a show dog owner, I prefer to use a harness on tiny puppies. I think a harness provides more protection for tiny developing necks while the puppy learns leash manners. Once the puppy gets older I may start using a martingale.

A martingale is like a cross between a slip collar and a flat collar. It has a chain connecting two rings on the end of the flat pieces. Unlike a slip collar, a properly adjusted martingale can't tighten enough to choke the dog. Unlike a flat collar, the dog can't drop his head and pop out of it. The martingale sits comfortably loose on the neck until the dog starts pulling, at which point it tightens to its set point.
Again, I appreciate the explanation. In the horse world, a Martingale is a totally different thing so I really didn't know what it meant as it applies to dog collars. It sounds perfect though. My beagle (who is now 15 years old) learned very early how to slip backwards out of a flat collar and so he has worn a metal choker type collar ever since. I hate the risk they pose though, if the dog were to get hung up on something by accident.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
840 Posts
I agree with harnesses for puppies, it is too easy to damage the neck trachea with any kind of a collar. Once my dog is walking reasonably on leash, I go to a martingale collar, and always remove it when we get home. I only put it on when we are going out somewhere and he will be with me, just because of the risk of the collar getting caught on something. A martingale will not tighten enough to choke, but I still don't want my dog getting hung up by it. Of course then there is the risk that you will forget to put it on, so I always keep an extra collar and leash in the car!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,027 Posts
Here is an example of the white pine limited slip collar I was referring to. Similar in idea to a martingale, but without the chain. They also make harnesses out of this soft web tubing. Just an FYI so you have options to consider.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DeniseM

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
24,153 Posts
Harnesses do wreck coat, and I also happen not to favor them for any kind of leash training (loose leash walking and such). When Lily was a young pup I had no collar on in the house but when I took her out it was either on a nylon slip collar or a woven nylon martingale collar. The advantage for both of them is that if your pup decides to stop moving or backs up they can't back out of the collar and be loose in a busy place with distractions and potential danger. Now the poodles both wear nice handmade leather collars with flat buckle day to day and will have pinch collars on during formal training even if they are off leash.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DeniseM

·
Registered
Joined
·
576 Posts
I prefer a harness with a puppy. It is very handy for getting them out of dangerous situations. If fitted properly they cannot back out of them. If an inexperienced person takes your dog for a walk or pulls on the harness the puppy is not going to get hurt or slip out of it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
29 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I prefer a harness with a puppy. It is very handy for getting them out of dangerous situations. If fitted properly they cannot back out of them. If an inexperienced person takes your dog for a walk or pulls on the harness the puppy is not going to get hurt or slip out of it.
My inner mom voice is telling me that a harness is the way to go. Eventually my dog will need to wear a harness anyway as she will be training as a mobility service dog.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
2,773 Posts
My inner mom voice is telling me that a harness is the way to go. Eventually my dog will need to wear a harness anyway as she will be training as a mobility service dog.
There you go. The first time she wears a harness she may look around uncertainly, hesitate to move, or try to chew on the harness. I manage this reaction by putting the harness on the pup and immediately starting a fun, distracting activity. Pretty soon the pup forgets about the harness. After a few fun excursions while wearing the harness the pup will associate it with fun and come right over when she sees you pick it up.

One caution: make sure you are gentle while pulling the harness over the pup's ears, especially if the pup happens to have an ear infection. My boy Snarky never trusted his harness again after some rough handling. He was fine once we got it on him, but he would dodge and duck furiously while we were trying to get it on.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
887 Posts
If I could redo Basil's 8-16+ weeks again knowing what I know now, I would just buy a front clip harness.

In addition to what's been mentioned, a harness helped us control Basil when we needed to hold her, grab her, or maneuver her when she was wiggly or needed redirection.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,970 Posts
Again, I appreciate the explanation. In the horse world, a Martingale is a totally different thing so I really didn't know what it meant as it applies to dog collars. It sounds perfect though. My beagle (who is now 15 years old) learned very early how to slip backwards out of a flat collar and so he has worn a metal choker type collar ever since. I hate the risk they pose though, if the dog were to get hung up on something by accident.
Denise, a slip/chain collar is just for training or walking. Otherwise either use a flat collar or no collar. I completely agree that leaving a slip collar on all the time is a recipe for disaster.

I have never used a harness on any breed of dog. All my dogs were trained with a slip collar beginning as little puppies. A little tug is used when the dog pulls. This was especially important with the whippets - those narrow heads and muscular necks can slip out of a non-slip collar in a flash. I used hound collars for them. A hound collar is designed for racing hounds. It has a wide cloth band that ends with D-rings. Then either a light chain goes through the D-rings or the actual leash goes through them to make a martingale. This collar is great for racing/coursing because you can pull the leash out through the rings to release the dog to run.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,970 Posts
One other thought - when I had standard poodles, I often used an ear (gently) as a lead. My mini is too close to the ground for that!

If you are thinking that using an ear is cruel, let's clarify: this assumes no ear infections and no yanking on the ear - just gentle guidance.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
38 Posts
I worked with a trainer who is a big fan of slip leads. I purchased these rolled leather slip leads from Amazon. They are fairly soft which is nice and don't mat hair too badly. I don't leave them on in the house. (I clip a long line to a flat collar for that) but they are very simple and easy for walks.

My breeder also told me never to use a harness on a puppy. I didn't ask why (I was too in love snuggling my new puppy) but i guess it's a common opinion?

As my dogs have gotten out of their puppy stages, I sometimes turn the slip lead into a gentle leader-style halter. Very useful when they don't feel like paying attention! (Which is more often than I like to admit)

As for flat collars, I like rolled leather or I'm really loving collars made from biothane. They clean easily and typically aren't too expensive. Widely available on Etsy.

Have fun!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
29 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I worked with a trainer who is a big fan of slip leads. I purchased these rolled leather slip leads from Amazon. They are fairly soft which is nice and don't mat hair too badly. I don't leave them on in the house. (I clip a long line to a flat collar for that) but they are very simple and easy for walks.

My breeder also told me never to use a harness on a puppy. I didn't ask why (I was too in love snuggling my new puppy) but i guess it's a common opinion?

As my dogs have gotten out of their puppy stages, I sometimes turn the slip lead into a gentle leader-style halter. Very useful when they don't feel like paying attention! (Which is more often than I like to admit)

As for flat collars, I like rolled leather or I'm really loving collars made from biothane. They clean easily and typically aren't too expensive. Widely available on Etsy.

Have fun!
I heard someone else mention on YouTube that they were loving biothane long leads for outdoor play because they clean up and dry off so easily. I am going to have to check them out.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
9,152 Posts
I heard someone else mention on YouTube that they were loving biothane long leads for outdoor play because they clean up and dry off so easily. I am going to have to check them out.
We love ours! They're great for dragging, too. They're much less likely to snag on things.
 
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
Top