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Discussion Starter #1
I don't want to argue with people about the validity of vaccines but I've seen many breeders taking a stand on how vaccines are given to their puppies when they go to their new homes and many are saying not to give 5-way shots at all. I saw one website that said they gave parvo starting at a very young age and ended up giving way more than what we were recommended to give Harry but it was just the parvo shot by itself.

Also Harry is due for his shots and my vet believes he needs every single booster shot that he got last year. I know he has to have rabies but what are your feelings on giving boosters every year like the vets tell you?
 

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my guys only got rabies this year. Next year they will have to get them all though as I plan to do therepy with Mandy and they insist on all shots
 

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It's a very personal decision, but I don't think dogs need all the recommended vaccines. There may be some diseases that aren't an issue in your area and many vaccines last way longer than a year. Bailey gets rabies b/c it's the law. Harley get rabies as scheduled and the required vaccines b/c I occasionally board him. JMO, but I think small dogs suffer more from overvaccination. I also don't understand why dogs need vaccines every year. We don't vaccinate ourselves that way. TX as a state allows for 3yr vaccs, but cities and counties can still put restrictions on vaccine schedules. Here, yearly rabies are required. My uncle lives in Houston and told me their dogs had to have two vaccines withing one year before they could qualify for every three years.
 

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I'm currently in England and only jumping on occasionally but had to chime in on this one. :) We do limited vaccines from early puppy hood on. As I have mentioned before, 3 out of the 4 Portuguese Water Dogs that we have owned have died of cancer (in upper age, but still) so we now feed raw and do limited vaccines. That means puppy vaccines as late as possible, rabies every 3 years and others as needed (we do titers).

Our thinking on this was just solidified even further this week. My uncle's cat here in the UK was just diagnosed with vaccine assisted carcinoma, which presented with a lump in the back of his neck. He has had the vet recommended vaccines every year in the exact same spot (where the tumor grew). He has had to have the tumor along with a large chunk of surrounding muscle removed and currently has an unknown prognosis as the surgery was just done this week. He's only 8, which is young for a cat. We definitely think we currently overvaccinate and hope conventional thinking catches up sooner rather than later.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
How is parvo so rampant if we are overvaccinated do you think? You would think that vaccines would erradicate the parvo virus all together. Is that because of the BYB and puppymillers that just don't vaccinate at all?
 

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This is an issue I feel strongly about. Everyone should research the available information and make their own informed decision. Google Dr. Jean Dodds and read her articles about vaccination protocols.

Overvaccination is an issue. I have probably 150 clients and know of 5 cases of vaccine reaction in the past year, 3 of which resulted in death. In my book, that is a high percentage.

Vets in my area STILL recommend annual vaccines, even thought the guidelines have changed to 3 years protocols for things other than bordatella and rabies. Studies have shown that dogs over the age of 5 or 6 who have had annual vaccines most likely do not ever need vaccination again. Even three years is probably too often, but the only way to really tell is through titers.

However, you must calculate your own risks. My own feeling is that if your dog has had its one year booster after the puppy shots, you are good for at least 3 years if not more. If your dog lives in the house and never goes anywhere, you are probably very very safe. Vaccines are big business, and often the only reasons many dogs ever go to the vet. Therefore, vets are very reticent to mention the change to the 3 year protocol and even less inclined to discuss the studies that show vaccines efficacies lasting even longer than that.

Bordatella is another controversial vaccine. Yes, bordatella is essentially a cold in dogs. There are many different strains of the virus. The bordatella may protect against several of the most popular strains, but this does not mean your dog won't pick up another. Think of it like the flu vaccine for humans. If the strain is different than the vaccine, you may still get the flu.

Do your own research and be informed and make the best decision based on your comfort level and your lifestyle. I shake my heads at the people who have a house confined dog or cat who never goes outside or anywhere who gets every vaccine every year.
 

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How is parvo so rampant if we are overvaccinated do you think? You would think that vaccines would erradicate the parvo virus all together. Is that because of the BYB and puppymillers that just don't vaccinate at all?
I think parvo is a separate issue, as parvo vaccination is part of initial puppy vaccines. There may be questions about whether the vaccinations are being administered properly or not, as sometimes the vaccine can interfere with the protection that occurs naturally from the mother (if she is covered for parvo). We personally would always vaccinate for parvo when they are pups, especially having experienced it first hand. We do think it is overvaccinated if done every year - we now do yearly titers for parvo to ensure our dogs are still covered. Ziggy only had 3 parvo shots as a pup and at 4 years old is still well protected.

I know our second PWD had the full vaccines for parvo as a pup and yet still contracted it at 8 months old and almost died. We now know that the protocol the breeder gave her and that we carried on with per our vet's advice probably knocked out her own immunity and left her vulnerable. This is why they now advocate a parvo shot done at around 16 to 18 weeks to ensure the pup is properly covered (she had her final puppy shot at approx 12 weeks.)
 

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I agree with the vaccinating over done. I have often wondered why we as children got our vaccines, spaced out as we grew, but never need them again as adults yet dogs get them every year of their lives. Of course, the puppy needs to have its vacs and they need to be done again after the pup reaches a year old, but after that, I am going to be careful on the use of vaccines with them. Rabbies here is done every three years, which I am glad about.

My Siamese cat, Slink, got all his vacs as a kitten and yearly for three years. He is an indoor cat so I decided years ago that he would not get them anymore. He is extremely healthy and does not look like a cat of 12 years old. He is energetic, has an excellent coat and no signs of aging at this point. We had another cat years ago that got his yearly boosters and by the age of 11 looked like an older cat. He died at the age of 12. He had severe cataracts in both eyes and just looked old. Now, I am sure genes have something to do with how these two separate cats have aged, but I believe it has helped my Slink to not have the vaccines he does not need anymore.
 

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I'll be vaccinating my dogs as soon as I'm able. I'm a groomer, so I'm always working around dogs and other animals, I would feel terrible if I brougth something home to my dog and got him or her sick because they weren't up to date like someone elses dog.
 

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How is parvo so rampant if we are overvaccinated do you think? You would think that vaccines would erradicate the parvo virus all together. Is that because of the BYB and puppymillers that just don't vaccinate at all?
While byb and puppy mills may have something to do with it, probably not much. They need their breeding stock to remain healthy, so most likely they are vaccinated. The puppies will retain the maternal protections until after they are sold. The reality is that vaccinations need to occur largely after puppies have left their mother. Think of all the people who get pets who can barely afford to feed them, much less get vaccinations and normal vet visits. These dogs can aquire and transmit parvo, which can live in the soil for up to year.
 

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For me its a case that my dogs go where I go even to work so they are not stay at home dogs. However there are several times a year that I have to board and they require proof of vaccines to be able to do so.(And for obedience classes also) including bordatella. I don't have a problem with having a titer done every year if these places would accept that. I do plan on inquiring about that before I give the annual booster again. Here in NC rabies in required every three years. Now my 4lb chihuahua hasn't had a yearly vacine since 2005. She is almost 12 now. But when we go out of town she stays with my inlaws.
 

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While byb and puppy mills may have something to do with it, probably not much. They need their breeding stock to remain healthy, so most likely they are vaccinated. The puppies will retain the maternal protections until after they are sold. The reality is that vaccinations need to occur largely after puppies have left their mother. Think of all the people who get pets who can barely afford to feed them, much less get vaccinations and normal vet visits. These dogs can aquire and transmit parvo, which can live in the soil for up to year.
Yes the mother gives them immunity until around 12 weeks and its strts to wane . We allow our puppie sto nurse if mom permits until the day they leave here for this reason . We give the puppy shot to adults and puppies . Rabies at 16 weeks. I have seen so many reactions to shots ! OMG Not in my poos thatnk god but in my setters So does this go back to an immune deficiancy in the line and not the shots per sey ? We live right off the indian reservation where no one vaccinates or spay and neuter the dogs they are allowed to run free . Parvo and distemper are rampant. Older dogs are immune but the babies are not ..
 

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I'll keep my opinions to myself, but let me say this:

Two days ago I saw a raccoon in the middle of the day, standing near the road, acting drunk.

I'd bet my last buck it was canine distemper. :(
 

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Or rabies.

Parvo is very rampant for many reasons. For one it is an Extreamly hard virus to get rid of, and most commercial cleaners cant kill it. Also, almost all puppies that get parvo are unvaccinated. At my clinic we rarely see parvo, but we treat a "higher, more expensive, whatever you want to call it clientele. Many other clinics in my town have a parvo ward they see So much of it!

I vaccinate for rabies as it is the law, give 3 year distemper vaccines, and vaccinate for lepto as it is common in my area and Riley has alot of the risks for it.

I know Kpoo mentioned combo vaccines. I think they are Great! For one, why give many shots when you can give one? Also, you can rarely get everything seperate anymore.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Well, I think some people want to avoid some of the vaccines in the shots. I know one that I hear a lot of negative about is lepto.
 

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I am also in favor of minimal vaccinations. My guys got all their puppy shots, get their required rabies shots every three years and other shots once every three years along with their rabies. Although next year when Brandy and Bugsy are due for their rabies and annual, we are just doing titers.
 

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I'm in favor of minimal vaccines too. Our cats got done as kittens, and have had another one since because they had to to go into the cattery while we went on our honeymoon earlier in the year, but otherwise I'm not at all interested in getting them done again unless for the same reason.

Same with the dogs, my terrier got her puppy vaccines primarily cos she was from the SPCA and they vaccinate everything they can get their hands on, but she's also only been vaccinated the once since then; for the (exact) same reason as the cats. She's 11.

Paris had her puppy ones, and I got her vaccinated again last year too, but I don't really intend to continue with annual shots or anything.

I'm a groomer too, and Paris comes to work with me every day so is in constant contact with oodles of dogs. I'm still not gonna do annual shots!!!

Luckily we don't have rabies in NZ *at all*, and we don't even need to vaccinate at all either, so there's no law about any vaccines at all.
 

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I follow Dr. Jean Dodds vaccine schedule.

I vaccinate puppies at 8, 12 and 16 (optional) weeks with Parvo/Distemper only. I give my own shots so I don't have to give bundled vaccines.

I give rabies as late as possible. The law in our state says 4 months, but I'm only now getting ready to get Delilah's rabies vaccine and she is 9 months. (Note.. this is a risk with the law).

I give a Parvo/Distemper booster again at 1 year and then I never give it again. I give rabies every three years according to law.

I do not give vaccines for:

Bordetella
Lepto
Hep
or Canine Influenza
 

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I work in a wealthy neighborhood, so I don't see much Parvo...anymore.

I used to work in a more 'rural' practice, and let me tell you, once you smell Parvo, you NEVER forget it. Yuck. :(


We saw quite a bit of Lymes disease exposure this year, and it was an unseasonably bad year for ticks. Very weird.

I do lepto on my own dogs because we have a high deer population in our area.

Our distemper is: Distemper, hepatitis, lepto, para-influenza, parvo and corona.
 

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I follow Dr. Jean Dodds vaccine schedule.

I vaccinate puppies at 8, 12 and 16 (optional) weeks with Parvo/Distemper only. I give my own shots so I don't have to give bundled vaccines.

I'm with you!
There are exceptions, once a pup leaves me as I realize they have dangers that I don't have here. They are not to give anything else until they pass it by me and I give them 'permission', so to say.

But giving annual vaccines will NEVER be permissable. If you would only read the box on the vaccine it states that it is good for 3 years. So for those who think annual/ combination is needed because your vet says so... tell me why your vet doesn't read it too?
 
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