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Killa and Tekno
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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Edit Edit: He's coming home this weekend!! I'll tell his story when he gets here, it's bittersweet but he's healthy and beautiful

Edit: I was contacted by a kind co-breeder and had some questions answered. Still a bit in the dark though and wouldn’t wish this anxiety on anybody. It sucks to not know if or when you’ll bring your puppy home especially during a pandemic when home is all you know lol.

I'm on the wait list for a toy poo and have been for about 5 months now. I have reached out to the breeder about once a month so that I don't bother her and I get updates here and there but no info about where I am on the waitlist or even a rough estimate of when I may be able to pick a puppy. Anybody had a similar experience? Is this because show breeders need to deal with their close connects first before pet owners? I'm feeling pretty nervous about it all and not sure why the info is a bit of a secret.
 

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This does sound a bit abnormal to me. Most breeders don't take deposits unless they have an expectation of being able to deliver a puppy within a reasonable time frame. It's possible there have been complications related to Covid. But a breeder should be honest with you. Most puppies from show breeders still go to pet homes, so while there may be an occasional hiccup if a breeder unexpectedly produces a spectacular puppy they want to hold back, I don't think this happens all the time.

But, given that I think you have a deposit with Clarion, I would not be overly worried. Clarion has an extremely good reputation and I would guess they've just been incredibly busy. Toys typically have very small litters, so it can be hard to predict what the puppy supply will be.
 

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Killa and Tekno
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Discussion Starter #3
Thank you. Yes I want to be hopeful (and patient) just feeling in the dark right now. Hopefully they come through though soon.
 

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That is a red flag to me. Certainly not someone I would trust. If it were me I would move on. Keep her « alive » in case she comes around, which I doubt, but find someone else.
 

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I hope this all works well without too much more worrying. I am not very familiar with tpoo breeders so I can't really comment on this breeder, but just generally for anyone looking for a pup and dealing with depostis there are two things I would not want to see in a breeder I was considering. First, will they take a deposit through PayPal or similar with no direct contact between parties/without a contract. Next how "hefty" is hefty? For Peeves we gave no deposit since BF had previously gotten a pup from the same breeder and for the poodles both deposits were $500 or substantially less.
 

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I'd call the breeder and in the nicest way possible explain to her that you're getting anxious. Tell her what your concerns are. If need be, shoulder the blame for being anxious, but calmly keep at it until you get the reassurances that you need.

In this difficult time, you don't need additional anxiety.
 

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If you are on a waitlist for a Clarion puppy, please be patient. I would take your spot in a heartbeat if I could have more than one dog. Great breeder choice, so be positive.
 

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If the breeder accepts the deposit, they have an obligation to give you some kind of a time frame. They can’t expect people to wait indefinitely.

I put a $500 deposit down for Gracie. I was #2 on the list. I had some life events and had to delay getting her. I think I could have gotten my money back if I wanted but I still wanted a pup so the deposit was applied to the next litter. So then I was #1 on the list, after the breeder chose a pup to keep. I knew roughly when the mating would occur, I Was informed when the pregnancy was confirmed, and received photos of the litter within hours of the birth. There were five pups in the litter. All that made the waiting easier. That was my experience.

She is a mini. I know toys have smaller litters but the lack of communication would concern me. Covid has complicated things though, I hope it all works out for you. Have they cashed the check yet?
 

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I can imagine how hard it is to wait without a lot of news forthcoming. One thing I feel sure of is that Clarion isn't going anywhere :).

I found a post (not from this year) where a member had put their deposit down in April and received their "puppy is here" call in November, so you're at least not the first with a longer than anticipated wait. They didn't mention how the contact was in between.
Have you tried the FB page? I don't know why you'd get a better response there but don't see how it could hurt.
 
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Killa and Tekno
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Discussion Starter #10
If you are on a waitlist for a Clarion puppy, please be patient. I would take your spot in a heartbeat if I could have more than one dog. Great breeder choice, so be positive.
Im not saying Clarion is not a great breeder. Ofc they are, that’s why I chose them. I am saying though that I have no clue where I am on the waitlist and Im wondering if this is normal. Please don’t encourage rumours that I am disparaging the breeder.
 

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Killa and Tekno
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Discussion Starter #11
I can imagine how hard it is to wait without a lot of news forthcoming. One thing I feel sure of is that Clarion isn't going anywhere :).

I found a post (not from this year) where a member had put their deposit down in April and received their "puppy is here" call in November, so you're at least not the first with a longer than anticipated wait. They didn't mention how the contact was in between.
Have you tried the FB page? I don't know why you'd get a better response there but don't see how it could hurt.
Thank you, yes Ive tried and they have contacted me. The only thing they shut down on is on time frames. My guess is that they used to give time frames and people took it as gold and held them to it. I would imagine that would be really annoying to deal with and now they don’t give time frames. I could fully respect that if they would just tell me that lol.
 

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Killa and Tekno
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Discussion Starter #12
If the breeder accepts the deposit, they have an obligation to give you some kind of a time frame. They can’t expect people to wait indefinitely.

I put a $500 deposit down for Gracie. I was #2 on the list. I had some life events and had to delay getting her. I think I could have gotten my money back if I wanted but I still wanted a pup so the deposit was applied to the next litter. So then I was #1 on the list, after the breeder chose a pup to keep. I knew roughly when the mating would occur, I Was informed when the pregnancy was confirmed, and received photos of the litter within hours of the birth. There were five pups in the litter. All that made the waiting easier. That was my experience.

She is a mini. I know toys have smaller litters but the lack of communication would concern me. Covid has complicated things though, I hope it all works out for you. Have they cashed the check yet?
Yes I paid in direct funds. They have the money :)
 

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Killa and Tekno
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Discussion Starter #13
Thank you everyone for the replies. Im going to be patient, its just really tough to be in the dark on something as exciting as welcoming a new family member :)
 

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Is this because show breeders need to deal with their close connects first before pet owners? I'm feeling pretty nervous about it all and like my money is probably gone...
I think part of this statement might have been taken as concerns about the breeder but you have clarified that :).

Many of the breeders that get recommendations from PF members will show some of their dogs to prove that they're breeding for the best possible poodles they can bring in to the world. Breeders who don't show, at least periodically, lose the opportunity to show that their dogs continue to meet the physical standards of the breed.

Most litters don't actually produce "show quality" pups, maybe 1 or 2 pups in several litters that might win in the conformation ring, which means the rest of us still get an excellent family pet.

When they are selecting a breeding partner (other breeder), if they expect show quality from the litter then, probably yes, the breeding partners will likely have "pick of the litter" as part of the contract between them and that's likely to be accounted for in the number of deposits they accept.

HTH
 
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I was complimenting you on your choice of breeder! Yay, you for getting on the list! I rather sympathize if a breeder can’t give you an order number. Let’s say you need an easy keeper or you want an agility partner. The best breeders are like matchmakers and they need to assess the temperaments, and then they get the first pick for their next BIS. What I did ask for and received in advance was the puppy guidance materials, diet and health stuff. I wanted to be prepared with my first poodle. I may have gotten pedigree information and health testing too, not sure. It’s like waiting for Christmas or your birthday. Definitely something to be excited about!
 

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Killa and Tekno
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Discussion Starter #16
I think part of this statement might have been taken as concerns about the breeder but you have clarified that :).

Many of the breeders that get recommendations from PF members will show some of their dogs to prove that they're breeding for the best possible poodles they can bring in to the world. Breeders who don't show, at least periodically, lose the opportunity to show that their dogs continue to meet the physical standards of the breed.

Most litters don't actually produce "show quality" pups, maybe 1 or 2 pups in several litters that might win in the conformation ring, which means the rest of us still get an excellent family pet.

When they are selecting a breeding partner (other breeder), if they expect show quality from the litter then, probably yes, the breeding partners will likely have "pick of the litter" as part of the contract between them and that's likely to be accounted for in the number of deposits they accept.

HTH
Oh I understand- yes I didn’t mean for it to sound like that Ill edit the original post
 

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Killa and Tekno
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Discussion Starter #17
I was complimenting you on your choice of breeder! Yay, you for getting on the list! I rather sympathize if a breeder can’t give you an order number. Let’s say you need an easy keeper or you want an agility partner. The best breeders are like matchmakers and they need to assess the temperaments, and then they get the first pick for their next BIS. What I did ask for and received in advance was the puppy guidance materials, diet and health stuff. I wanted to be prepared with my first poodle. I may have gotten pedigree information and health testing too, not sure. It’s like waiting for Christmas or your birthday. Definitely something to be excited about!
oh, thank you, I misunderstood. Also had a crappy day at work so probably a little sensitive. I just hope to get some info soon :)
 

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Killa and Tekno
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Discussion Starter #18
Update: Im still kind of in the dark about whether Ill receive a puppy or not. Now it’s dependent on how many show prospects there are. I’m going to be honest and say the waiting pretty much brings me to tears. Its been a few months now of trickling bits of information. I think it’s one thing to know okay itll be 3-6 months, here’s the planned breedings, and here’s where you are in the waitlist, and quite another to not know much of anything and just waiting week after week to get a phone call that may or may not come. I know for sure I will never do this process again. I hate it. I don’t know an alternative with reputable breeders but this, whatever this is, is not for me. In my mind there would have been photos of the litters, puppy updates, opening eyes, first steps, I wanted to know about it all but instead it’s me nervously waiting for a message or call, buying puppy supplies to fill the time, reading puppy book after puppy book, and still not knowing if my puppy even exists. It sucks. This isn’t to disparage any breeder, its just a view from the adopter’s side: waiting patiently for a family member in the dark, just plain sucks.
 

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Update: Im still kind of in the dark about whether Ill receive a puppy or not. Now it’s dependent on how many show prospects there are. I’m going to be honest and say the waiting pretty much brings me to tears. Its been a few months now of trickling bits of information. I think it’s one thing to know okay itll be 3-6 months, here’s the planned breedings, and here’s where you are in the waitlist, and quite another to not know much of anything and just waiting week after week to get a phone call that may or may not come. I know for sure I will never do this process again. I hate it. I don’t know an alternative with reputable breeders but this, whatever this is, is not for me. In my mind there would have been photos of the litters, puppy updates, opening eyes, first steps, I wanted to know about it all but instead it’s me nervously waiting for a message or call, buying puppy supplies to fill the time, reading puppy book after puppy book, and still not knowing if my puppy even exists. It sucks. This isn’t to disparage any breeder, its just a view from the adopter’s side: waiting patiently for a family member in the dark, just plain sucks.
I totally get it. I would have a hard time too. My dog's breeder sent weekly photos and videos. But I only really started to get attached in the last couple weeks after their faces were shaved. With my breeder I contacted her and she vetted me and then told me she had a litter born a week prior that had an open spot. So I knew from the time I put a deposit down that I was getting a pup. But other breeders I was in contact with were months from having litters on the ground. They all do it differently. I think it is hard to predict things with toys and especially now during the pandemic. I am sure you will be thrilled once you have your pup. Hang in there.
 

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Phaz23, it IS hard to wait. I found it emotionally painful, though eventually it did come to a pleasant end in my case. In the pool of great breeders with awesome dogs there is a lot of variety in how communication with future puppy owners takes place. I attribute this mostly to individual personalities and what is happening in their life. Some great breeders are very talented at the communication part of their business, and their are lots of beautiful photos and videos and private FB groups for litter discussions, etc. Bless them, it fills a future puppy family with joy to have this level of communication. I think this level of communication is the exception. The much less level of communication you would like to be receiving from your breeder seems like it should be doable by most, but not all, great breeders.

For me the distress of waiting was like the pains of labor, or a fever dream, which began to fade after that sweet puppy was placed in my arms. For you the distress may be amplified by this terrible, horrible, no-good year we are having. It would be such a comfort in this dark winter to have a puppy, or even just hopeful news about the puppy plans. I think we can all understand your angst about where you are in the process.
 
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