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Discussion Starter #1
Found out today that I can scream bloody murder (and I now really understand that phrase) when Neo and Remo are in danger. We were walking today in our neighborhood as we do daily, weather permitting. We'd reached the turn back point when I saw a tiny unleashed Yorkie skedaddle across the street and up the road in the general direction we were heading. The game was afoot.

We followed the Yorkie til the pup peeled off into an unfenced yard and ran to the back door. I was hoping that was home so we went around to the front door, rang and knocked with no response but I heard someone come down the inside stairs and then what sounded like the back door open and close. With still no response, I went to look in the back again and no visible Yorkie. I could only hope the pup was home.

We found ourselves on a block we don't usually walk so I'm not as familiar with the potential hazards. We were coming up to a house which had two madly barking dogs at the glass storm door. They were barking and leaping on the door when it sprang open and they sprang loose, racing towards my boys with clearly no good intentions. I was screaming at them as they approached with no effect. They hit like an F5 tornado.

Remo managed to distance himself at the end of his leash but Neo applied himself to my leg as they hit. He was screaming, I was screaming, I was trying to get him out of reach, keep an eye on Remo, hope that help would come, wondering if I should be kicking the attackers. As I got Neo up, the two were biting Neo's feet and legs. Help came.

The missus came out and got control of hers rather quickly. And, no, not a visibly pit type. The larger looked something of a medium sized village dog undecipherable mix, well muscled, and the smaller looked chihuahuaesque. Missus and Mister were very apologetic and saying the right things. Mister was a bit extreme in his solution, saying he would have his dogs killed asap. Missus managed him and he ended saying he'd just hide them so they wouldn't be taken away and killed. I told him neither solution was needed but he felt no one could be trusted to keep their word.

There was blood so I called DH and we decided to go directly to the ER vet. Neo has one for sure small puncture wound on his leg. Per the doc, there might be more but believes probably not. Wound cleaned, no stitching, no bandages, no xray, RX for antibiotics and back at home a while ago. Otherwise, he and Remo seem to have recovered from the initial trauma.

I also have a small scratch, the full poop bag was shredded so Neo ended up getting some of his own back. This could have easily been so much worse. It wasn't. For that, I'm grateful.

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I feel for you and your babies. This is a story I hear way way too many times and have had experienced myself. In this case, it doesn't sound like full negligence on the part of the owner as the dogs were not roaming free but still they are at fault for not being aware their door was not strong enough to withstand the pounding. I would wager this had happened before as you can't be the first person to walk down the street with a dog and cause pressure to hit the door. Sadly though, there is a small chance you were the first and the door in the past was just weakened until you lost the lottery and it finally broke.

You know you are within your rights to ask that the vet bills be covered. If it was me, I would show them the actual bill and say you would rather handle it between good neighbors and not risk the authorities as then their babies may be confiscated. I would be sure if it was me to present this in a most diplomatic way. If they refuse, you would then have to decide how much you feel they were not taking reasonable care to contain their dogs and proceed by following your heart.

If they do pay up, you may want to plant a seed and just ask "for a friend" how they have fixed strengthening their door because your "friend" has the same problem and when she heard your story really wanted to make sure she did everything she could to make sure her dogs didn't get in a fight and be taken away, or worse - lose the fight and their life.

I'm glad it wasn't worse. But I wish it didn't happen at all. Have good hugs and give lots of healing hugs. And a cyber hug to you too.
 

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We read about this sort of thing all the time, but it hits me harder that a bad encounter could have been a disaster for you and little Neo and maybe Remo. Thank God they weren't huge dogs with high prey drives, aka Pits.

I'm so sorry Rose that went through this, so glad everyone, including you, are okay.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Thank you for us all.

They offered immediately to cover the vet cost, which also could have been a lot worse. They gave nothing away, if it has happened before, but thought that probably the door hadn't latched fully while bringing in the groceries. It's plausible. The Mister, while not seeming at all agitated, was offering some extreme ideas, so if they don't follow thru, I'm more inclined to let it drop with them but may consider following up thru conventional routes.

I would feel a responsibility if this should happen again to someone else. As you said, the dogs were in their own house, til they broke out, so I wouldn't call it negligence in their dog ownership either, but their door maintenance was a bit lacking. That's a good nonjudgmental approach you suggested.

Oddly, a similar incident happened last summer on a street closer to home. The lab of our neighbor, who is also our plumber (how's that for luck lol), managed to paw down the levered handle of the storm door and came bouncing out to greet the boys on our way home. With him I felt no danger, but the boys were not liking that at all. They still shy a bit when we go by there, His person was also pretty quickly responsive.
 

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This is so upsetting to me! What a frightening experience. It sounds like you've all handled it as well as can be expected, but still so very traumatic for both you and your dogs.

Hope you're all cuddled in close tonight and can have a peaceful day tomorrow.
 

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I've been nearby when pepper spray was deployed and it was awful. Took my breath away and others required emergency treatment.

I wonder if there are better options out there. I keep a whistle attached to my jacket, near my mouth so I could easily call for help in emergency situations. But I'd like to add some sort of spray.
 

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I've been nearby when pepper spray was deployed and it was awful. Took my breath away and others required emergency treatment.

I wonder if there are better options out there. I keep a whistle attached to my jacket, near my mouth so I could easily call for help in emergency situations. But I'd like to add some sort of spray.
In Ajijic, Mexico, a lot of the dog owners carried a can of wasp spray. It looked bulky to carry and I wondered about the long term effects on the dogs or them for that matter. Then there was the tiny little lady that carried a long cattle prod. I got that as a better option as the shock is short term. But she looked very nutty walking around with the thing.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I learned a few other things today about just what's possible in the lightspeed these attacks seem to happen in. Instinct is practically all you have unless you've literally trained for this.

Does anyone know if there's such a thing as safety training classes to attend? Not person safety only but to protect your dog/s too. There's no way I'm letting them fend for themselves. If you don't have practiced techniques and muscle memory working for you, you're all in danger.

When this subject has come up before, I'd thought about carrying an umbrella or walking stick. That's not even a little realistic when you're managing two pups. I keep a whistle handy, not even a nanosecond available to grab it, and I needed my hands to do other things.

If this should ever happen again, my feet are my only weapon. I understand that now. Letting go the leashes crossed my mind for that split second but I split second decided that wasn't right here. Neo was plastered to me and up was the only way to keep him even a bit safe. Remo, sensibly and shaking, just tried to stay invisible.
 

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I'm so sorry that this happened to you guys?. I'm glad that it wasn't any worse. (Hugs to you guys) from what you were saying the Mister seemed really intense. Maybe they could work with a trainer or something instead and get their door fixed so that it won't happen again
 

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I learned a few other things today about just what's possible in the lightspeed these attacks seem to happen in. Instinct is practically all you have unless you've literally trained for this.

Does anyone know if there's such a thing as safety training classes to attend? Not person safety only but to protect your dog/s too. There's no way I'm letting them fend for themselves. If you don't have practiced techniques and muscle memory working for you, you're all in danger.

When this subject has come up before, I'd thought about carrying an umbrella or walking stick. That's not even a little realistic when you're managing two pups. I keep a whistle handy, not even a nanosecond available to grab it, and I needed my hands to do other things.

If this should ever happen again, my feet are my only weapon. I understand that now. Letting go the leashes crossed my mind for that split second but I split second decided that wasn't right here. Neo was plastered to me and up was the only way to keep him even a bit safe. Remo, sensibly and shaking, just tried to stay invisible.
I don't know if there's something like that or not, but I've been wondering the same thing.
 

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I learned a few other things today about just what's possible in the lightspeed these attacks seem to happen in. Instinct is practically all you have unless you've literally trained for this.

Does anyone know if there's such a thing as safety training classes to attend? Not person safety only but to protect your dog/s too. There's no way I'm letting them fend for themselves. If you don't have practiced techniques and muscle memory working for you, you're all in danger.

When this subject has come up before, I'd thought about carrying an umbrella or walking stick. That's not even a little realistic when you're managing two pups. I keep a whistle handy, not even a nanosecond available to grab it, and I needed my hands to do other things.

If this should ever happen again, my feet are my only weapon. I understand that now. Letting go the leashes crossed my mind for that split second but I split second decided that wasn't right here. Neo was plastered to me and up was the only way to keep him even a bit safe. Remo, sensibly and shaking, just tried to stay invisible.
I honestly believe if this situation were to ever happen to Miracle that she would be severely injured or much worse. She would growl or lunge due to her own fearful reaction, which only seemed to get worse when unleashed dogs in my previous apartment complex approached her. I started walking her away from residential areas, but where I live now, that is no longer a possibility. The only good plan I have is to pick her up, which is what I've already done in several instances, but I know it's not the best plan.
 

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Self-defense with a canine focus would be an excellent class. I'd certainly take it! But I've never heard of one, at least not around here.

It's pretty remarkable how our bodies take over when supercharged with adrenaline. You're right that it would be helpful to have muscle memory kick in. Otherwise it's easy to make things worse, such as by sticking your vulnerable hands into the danger zone (as I foolishly did when Peggy was attacked at our local dog park).

I think wearing sturdy footwear is a good start. No flip-flops or sandals. But that wouldn't be much help when confronted with a pit, GSD, or similar.

I've heard you're supposed to stick your finger in an attacking dog's bum, or lift their hind legs. But imagine having the presence of mind to do so? Or even the ability to maneuver yourself into the right position? Seems unlikely in most heightened situations, unless you're at a dog park or similar, where you're apart from your dog and approaching the fight from the outside.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Self-defense with a canine focus would be an excellent class
I've done a quick search and found nothing like. This sounds like a business waiting to happen!

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Hijacking my own thread for a minute

And I meant to mention earlier that I thanked the staff at the clinic on behalf of Poodle Forum and my family. I asked them to please pass on the good wishes to the staff not there tonight.

I've seen several threads re the stress animal health workers are under and wanted them to know that a body such as PF recognizes and appreciates what they do and how hard it can be for them.

The vet, who was already very nice, just lit up and talked for a few minutes about how hard it can be for them too.

Thanks PF for recognizing those efforts!
 

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I've done a quick search and found nothing like. This sounds like a business waiting to happen!

------------

Hijacking my own thread for a minute

And I meant to mention earlier that I thanked the staff at the clinic on behalf of Poodle Forum and my family. I asked them to please pass on the good wishes to the staff not there tonight.

I've seen several threads re the stress animal health workers are under and wanted them to know that a body such as PF recognizes and appreciates what they do and how hard it can be for them.

The vet, who was already very nice, just lit up and talked for a few minutes about how hard it can be for them too.

Thanks PF for recognizing those efforts!
It does sound like a business waiting to happen!

That's awesome that you did that. Yeah, I've read things about the stress that Animal Health Workers are under. I'm so glad that the vet lit up
 

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Discussion Starter #17
It is so sad that this all started with you trying to help an unleashed dog. :( I am so very sorry this happened to you and your dogs. I am glad you are okay. Poor Neo.
I'm still concerned for that little Yorkie. I wish I knew for sure that she (I think) is home and well tonight. She's one of the extra small's. Feisty, naturally, but so very small.
 

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I am glad you and the pups are ok. It must have been very scary. I hope the family will strengthen their door so that this does not happen again. I do hope they pay the vet bill it could have gone a lot for for them too if you weren't a calm dog loving person who understood that things do happen and if you make it right life goes on as normal. Some people would be ready to sue them right off the bat, even if it were an accident. I have had dogs run a me and my dogs too, its not pleasant. My motto is fix the problem so it doesn't happen again. If they do not well then another story. I like the link Vita shared for pepper spray. I'd hate to use it but it could save a life.
 
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