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Discussion Starter #1
I can sometimes have an inclination to use my clicker like a remote control, and *point* it when I click (duh!) now I *KNOW* better, but it still happens at times! lol. Paris is also sometimes inclined to throw anything at me and watches for my hand movement either for the click or when I move to the food or to feed her, rather than paying attention to what I'm clicking.

So my trainer suggested an exercise to help us; teaching Paris to put her head inside a bucket! Both to give us something rather unimportant to teach (we can screw it up and it won't really affect our competitive training), as well as teaching Paris to LISTEN for the click better (she can't see me moving if her head is inside a bucket!)

So I had a quiet day at work on friday, and within a few mins we had it down nicely, though I've yet to add very *much* duration to it, we'll work on that another day.


it's silly, but incredibly cute when her big fluffy head disappears inside a bucket, so I had to share!!!! And hey, might be useful to play about with for anyone else having similar problems... or for someone bored. LOL!
 

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Hahahah! Looks like fun! I think I'll try this with Desmond.
Oh, and I lol'd at the end when you realized she'd been licking the bucket... hahaha! Classic Paris! :)
 

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I'm having fun, fun, fun watching these videos you've posted. Paris has got it down.

Now for a question---I was reading a book by Karen Pryor's and she mentions that eventually you only reward them with food randomly, so they don't expect a treat every time. I'd like to train with food and clicker but don't want Rebel to only do what he's supposed to do when there is food involved. How do you transition? Do they eventually obey on command without the clicker and without the food? The obedience instructor I'm now going to doesn't use food as a motivator because he says that you don't want them only obeying for a food reward. Help me understand, please.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
MericoX, Paris is already very adept at figuring out shaping behaviours, the context is me sitting in a chair with clicker & treats, which is essentially her cue to start throwing behaviours at me. So when I put the bucket down she immediately went to look at it, which got clicked. She tried hitting it a couple of times with her front feet but with that being ignore she went back to sniffing it, which got clicked. Every time she got clicker she'd pop her head back up for her treat, and drop her head back down to look; just like in the first bit of the movie. I just kept up a really rapid-fire series of click & treat for her trying to sniff at the bucket. She was pretty sure there might be something inside the bucket so she was quite happy to stick her head inside it just to check, and that got a jackpot (treat, treat, treat, treat. Rapid fire one after the other with no clicks in between). Paris is smart, she literally took about 30 seconds before she was sticking her head inside the bucket happily.


For when I'm TRAINING something, I use the clicker and treats a LOT. It really is such a fast accurate way to train things! Once it's *trained* I use various other rewards (a simple "YES!!" [instead of the click, as I certainly don't have my clicker on me at all times!] and play, a tug game, chasing a ball, bouncing on the spot, whatever makes her go 'YAY!') Paris LOOOOOVES to bounce and be silly, she also adores to run, so they in themselves are rewards for being good too!

I use food to train things initially as they are faster and easier to use is all. :)
 

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Thanks for the info, FD. I'm starting to understand. Think my Rebeldog would benefit from that training since he's VERY food motivated! Will get me a clicker and let you know how it goes. Keep your videos coming!!!
 

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FD- this is a great video BTW for showing how shaping with the clicker works :) i'm passing on to some students!
 

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Oh, wow! I LOOOVE Paris' haircut, and the pink is so awesome and cute. Double wow. What a gorgeous girl. I showed your video to my fiance, and I think it's why he finally said, "Yes. You can get a poodle." He's citing my persistence, but I think you and Paris were the tipping point.
 

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I'm having fun, fun, fun watching these videos you've posted. Paris has got it down.

Now for a question---I was reading a book by Karen Pryor's and she mentions that eventually you only reward them with food randomly, so they don't expect a treat every time. I'd like to train with food and clicker but don't want Rebel to only do what he's supposed to do when there is food involved. How do you transition? Do they eventually obey on command without the clicker and without the food? The obedience instructor I'm now going to doesn't use food as a motivator because he says that you don't want them only obeying for a food reward. Help me understand, please.
Yeah, once the dog has it down pretty well, where they're performing the behavior just how you want it using the treats, then you start to phase out the treats. You can do like she does with Paris and substitute click/treat for other rewards. You can also just start giving him treats for doing it a little less often. Like every third or fourth time Rebel does the trick you give him praise or something in place of a treat.

As you start to hold off on treats more and more often, then every now and then you give him a jackpot of treats (like, lots and lots of awesome treats at once). Basically, Rebel never knows when he's going to get something amazing. After a while you can just about phase out the treats completely.

Does that make sense? I'm not sure if I worded it in a way that makes sense.
 

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Yeah, once the dog has it down pretty well, where they're performing the behavior just how you want it using the treats, then you start to phase out the treats. You can do like she does with Paris and substitute click/treat for other rewards. You can also just start giving him treats for doing it a little less often. Like every third or fourth time Rebel does the trick you give him praise or something in place of a treat.

As you start to hold off on treats more and more often, then every now and then you give him a jackpot of treats (like, lots and lots of awesome treats at once). Basically, Rebel never knows when he's going to get something amazing. After a while you can just about phase out the treats completely.

Does that make sense? I'm not sure if I worded it in a way that makes sense.
Thanks, Lisasgirl. That does make sense. And I see that it's a gradual thing-- starting off with clicking/giving a treat every time while he's learning the behavior, then every other time, then every third or fourth time, and, finally, giving a jackpot randomly so that he's always looking for the reward. I'm going to try that and see if it doesn't work. Thanks again for explaining it.
 

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FD thanks for posting this. It gave me some great ideas for Lacey and her clicker training.
Are there any fun little tricks you've taught Paris that your clients or friends really enjoy?
I'd really like to shape Lacey for a couple of fun little things for our therapy work.
You and Paris always inspire me :)
 

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Discussion Starter #13
simple things like shaking hands (and then switching back and forwards to the other paw doing sorta 'patty cake' type play) are always cute. "dirty face", when Paris is laying down, causes her to wipe her paw across her face and always gets a laugh... Working on that more, 'shame' [covering her face with front paw/s rather than just wiping at it] is very cute too! A simple play bow or beg or something too!

My next one, when I get around to it, will be me going 'AHH CHOO!' and Paris going to get me a tissue from the box... I might record the whole process and free shape it... hmm.
 

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How do you transition to putting a command word on it and only getting her to do it when you ask? I imagine that you would only click and treat when she did it after the command, but is there an intermediate step?

If you wanted her to run to the bucket placed at a distance do you think you would need to teach the go out as a separate exercise? Or, could you say BUCKET and expect her to run to the bucket right away?

What if you say BUCKET and she does not perform the task? Is there any repercussion or correction?
 

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simple things like shaking hands (and then switching back and forwards to the other paw doing sorta 'patty cake' type play) are always cute. "dirty face", when Paris is laying down, causes her to wipe her paw across her face and always gets a laugh... Working on that more, 'shame' [covering her face with front paw/s rather than just wiping at it] is very cute too! A simple play bow or beg or something too!

My next one, when I get around to it, will be me going 'AHH CHOO!' and Paris going to get me a tissue from the box... I might record the whole process and free shape it... hmm.
Yes Yes Yes! Thanks a bunch :)
Love the AHH CHOO idea
 

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Discussion Starter #16
the bucket thing doesn't have a cue cos it was just an exercise in getting Paris to LISTEN for the clicker rather than look for my movements. If I wanted to add a cue, I'd start saying the cue, just before/as she did the exercise I wanted to be cued (ie sticking her head in the bucket) to pair the exercise & cue together. Do that a few times and then wait a second, if she sticks her head straight in without the cue, it'd get ignored, I'd wait for her to stop and go 'hu?' then I'd say the cue (that having already paired with the action, will invariably cause her to get up and 'try again') and click/jackpot. Etc etc. 'extinction' is when the behaviour, without a cue, will be ignored basically.

To add distance to it, I'd start by having the bucket on one side of me, and when I click, the treat will be tossed away a bit, so she goes off to get the treat, comes back to stick her head in. Then just move the bucket furthur away from me really, allowing her to run to the bucket and stick her head in. lol!!!
 
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