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Old 11-18-2012, 08:21 AM   #11 (permalink)
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It sounds like redirected aggression to me, too - and as if your sister has some excellent ideas on how to proceed! I'd also work on lots of impulse control games - Leave it, of course, but also turn taking ("This one is for...Carley", "This one is for ...Stella") with the dogs sitting politely to wait their turns), Wait, and any other games you can think of that teach her that Good Stuff happens to poodles who can control their immediate reactions, whether that is to grab, rush, or blame her sister!
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:27 AM   #12 (permalink)
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I just talked to their breeder. She said I need to not be so soft with my dogs and make sure that they know I am the pack leader. Today, my husband was playing with Carley and Stella started to hump her. I made her stop and then she started giving Carley the evil eye... I was telling the breeder about this and she said I should have grabbed Stella and put her on her back got on top of her and growled at her. Made her lay there until she gave up. I am not sure I can do that... I think I need to take more control, I am soft with my dogs and I fear Stella's last owner was even more of a push over than I am. I do think the breeder has the advantage that she has raised all her dogs from pups. I have a 2 1/2 year old adult dog, but I am going to try.
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:55 AM   #13 (permalink)
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I am a big fan of positive training for a lot of reasons, one of them being that my current dog shows little response to raised voice other than to get more rowdy, which is never what I am trying to do. My last dog would act like the world was ending if I raised my voice. So I feel where you are coming from on being surprised with the difference.

Definitely work on catching situations earlier like sister in law said, when the ears start. So much easier to redirect attention and get her to do something you can reward her for, like paying attention to you or sitting or not pulling on the leash. Then reward the heck out of her for doing good things in the presence of distractions. She will start to look to you for rewards in those situations instead of acting out. (I was a little skeptical of this claim until I saw it in action! A runner came towards us and Pearl turned toward me and sat for a treat!!! Not her normal puppy behavior! Not yet a regular occurrence, she still wants to mob most of them...) Fun for dogs and people! And if you can't get her attention, get further away from the stimulating thing.

Click to Calm by Emma Parsons is a book I have but have not read all of yet, it has some neat info and exercises for this type of thing.
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Old 11-18-2012, 11:05 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Carley's Mom View Post
I just talked to their breeder. She said I need to not be so soft with my dogs and make sure that they know I am the pack leader. Today, my husband was playing with Carley and Stella started to hump her. I made her stop and then she started giving Carley the evil eye... I was telling the breeder about this and she said I should have grabbed Stella and put her on her back got on top of her and growled at her. Made her lay there until she gave up. I am not sure I can do that... I think I need to take more control, I am soft with my dogs and I fear Stella's last owner was even more of a push over than I am. I do think the breeder has the advantage that she has raised all her dogs from pups. I have a 2 1/2 year old adult dog, but I am going to try.
That is very old school. She is your dog now to raise as you see fit. you can be firm and kind at the same time, firm to me means being consistent, unbending in what you think is right and good. Not giving in to frustration with a situation and taking the easy way out will make you feel firm and not soft. However you can be kind and do this with positive motivation if you desire. Flipping the dog over is only going to tell her that you are acting weird and unstable. Rewarding her for stopping humping will make both of you feel good and get the message across more clearly. You will have to redirect her multiple times and not give up, that is where not being soft comes in. Giving her behaviors she can please you with is being kind.
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Old 11-18-2012, 11:30 AM   #15 (permalink)
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The breeder may have raised her, but I would most certainly not take her advice on behaviour if she is advocating "dominance" alpha rolls! I do think it is important to set boundaries, but aversive techniques like rolls, hold downs, shouting, etc, etc just risk making matters worse - and, as FP says, convincing Stella that you are dangerously psychotic as well. There are plenty of positive ways of training for what you want - your sister sounds as if she is on the right track - I'd be interested to hear what she makes of your breeder's advice!
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Old 11-18-2012, 11:52 AM   #16 (permalink)
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I will not be flipping her on her back. It is just not in me to be like that. But I do think I will say,"NO!" And then move her a bit more rough than before. When she humps Carley, I have just took her by her collar and told her to stop that, not even loud. I think it may take more than that for Stella, she is very strong willed. The breeder sold Stella when she was a pup, she kept Carley for 7 years and to her credit, Carley is perfect in every way... lol So I was interested in her advice. I have always been "soft" with all my dogs and all my dogs have been very well trained and done great. I have only had Stella a month ! She has come a long way in that short time. I think she will continue to get better and better. Thanks for all the advice !
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Old 11-18-2012, 12:29 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Carley's mom..it's not about "soft"..it's about brattiness. This is where the "train-ability" of Spoos enters. She just needs training. Rewards for good behavior, and "growls" for bad. Please don't roll her or act more aggressively towards her. Trust her to be able to learn new behavior.. she can. Like the other poster said..be consistent and firm. Seems she has been allowed to misbehave or just not properly trained to behave. Assert yourself as trainer, but don't do it by bullying or hurting her. Be confident in your actions and be confident in her ability to learn something new..Spoos are great at this! Think "time out" instead of "spanking"..it works.
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Old 11-18-2012, 12:59 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Carley's Mom View Post
I will not be flipping her on her back. It is just not in me to be like that. But I do think I will say,"NO!" And then move her a bit more rough than before. When she humps Carley, I have just took her by her collar and told her to stop that, not even loud. I think it may take more than that for Stella, she is very strong willed. The breeder sold Stella when she was a pup, she kept Carley for 7 years and to her credit, Carley is perfect in every way... lol So I was interested in her advice. I have always been "soft" with all my dogs and all my dogs have been very well trained and done great. I have only had Stella a month ! She has come a long way in that short time. I think she will continue to get better and better. Thanks for all the advice !
Stella sounds like Trev, very pushy. As in "what can I get away with today?!" I have to be pretty firm with him. It sounds like that's all Stella needs. Be fair, (poodles like things to be fair or they get their feelings tied in a knot.) but require her to behave. A lot of it is in your attitude. Trev may be pushy, but he knows what line not to cross, and he knows when he has crossed it. (You should see him when he knows a time out is coming...lol! It's pretty funny. He's even run and crated himself before.) And that's not because I smack my dogs around or yell at them. I carry the attitude of the leader, but not in the sense of Cesar Milan alpha rolls and pokes. It's simply an attitude of what I say goes. But I think part of that is also knowing when to back off, and also showing them that you love them and everything you do is for their good. It's really more of a parent-child relationship than king (or queen)-subject domination. You wouldn't let a kid get away with fighting another kid, same kind of thing with Stella. And who knows....as you continue to work with her, even in other areas, she may feel less frustrated and more content and this problem will disappear without too much more drama. A month isn't much time, she is still settling in and getting used to everything.
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Old 11-18-2012, 04:25 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I do stay very calm and I do have the leadership role , Stella's is just going to be a harder dog... she knows what "come " means, I am sure of it. But she doesn't always come... today everytime we went out I had a bag of turkey in my pocket and she was an angel. lol I feel better about it now than when I started this thread, lots of great advice, thanks. We will get there, I am sure of it. I will continue to be a softie too, just as sure of that as well. lol
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Old 11-18-2012, 04:54 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Hi Carley's mom, ever since day1, first time Lou wasn't listening to me I'd lay her down and hold her down by neck/shoulder and hip kinda on her side, at first with a very firm voice but NO physical strength just enough to hold her from taking off, more of an assertiveness thing and the most important: I'd say "caaaaaaaalm dooooooooown" a few times till she stopped breathing fast and relaxed her muscles. When she sighed and relaxed id praise her and let her lay down "upward" instead of on her side for a few minutes maintaning my eye contact but petting her and "good girl, caaaalm dooown". First few times I sounded really mean and laid her on her side. Now I just approach her with that firm/loud voice and assertiveness ( like... I mean it!!!!) she throws herself on the floor belly up, tail wagging and I pet her and say the calm down command again.... BUT I'M NO EXPERT, it was just instinct when i did that, and it worked for me because i was NOT afraid of her, and she noticed that...

But I am afraid if other dogs... They feel it too... They know it..

I wish you the best dear!! Hope it's all better soon soon


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