Question about AKC point schedules - Poodle Forum - Standard Poodle, Toy Poodle, Miniature Poodle Forum ALL Poodle owners too!
   

Go Back   Poodle Forum - Standard Poodle, Toy Poodle, Miniature Poodle Forum ALL Poodle owners too! > Poodle Training and Obedience > Showing

Showing A place to discuss all aspects of Breed Show Competition, AKC or UKC or other. Questions, thoughts, brags.

PoodleForum.com is the premier Poodle Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-16-2017, 02:30 PM   #1 (permalink)
Member
Points: 469, Level: 9 Points: 469, Level: 9 Points: 469, Level: 9
Activity: 46.6% Activity: 46.6% Activity: 46.6%
Last Achievements
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 89
Thanks: 7
Thanked 82 Times in 52 Posts
Default Question about AKC point schedules

Looking at the AKC point schedule, I am wondering if anyone can tell me how the number of competition dogs or bitches needed to win points is determined. Is it strictly based on how many people are showing in that region? The reason I ask is because in our region (and in many other regions) for spoos, the bitches need around double the amount of competition than the dogs to get the some of the majors. For a 5 point major, dogs need to beat 7 (sounds difficult, but doable) but bitches need to beat 16 (yikes!!)

I am just wondering if this means that in my area most people are showing bitches, thus the need for higher numbers? We are in region 13, but some of the others have similar numbers. It is the opposite of what I would expect because it seems to me that most breeders are more concerned with championing their dogs to use as studs, while I thought that breeders weren't usually as focused on championing every bitch. If anyone could enlighten me on this I would greatly appreciate it! Here's the link to the point schedules:
Conformation Point Schedule - American Kennel Club
chinchillafuzzy is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to chinchillafuzzy For This Useful Post:
poshandpoodles (04-17-2017)
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 04-16-2017, 06:10 PM   #2 (permalink)
Senior Member
Points: 2,901, Level: 35 Points: 2,901, Level: 35 Points: 2,901, Level: 35
Activity: 58.1% Activity: 58.1% Activity: 58.1%
Last Achievements
 
Verve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Names of dogs: Phoebe, Parker
Poodle Type: Standard
Posts: 333
Thanks: 662
Thanked 687 Times in 256 Posts
Default

It is very typical for the point schedule to be much easier for dogs than bitches. That does reflect typical entries. The reality is that a few boys get most of the action, while most bitch owners want to finish their bitches, hence the difference in numbers.
Verve is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Verve For This Useful Post:
CharismaticMillie (04-16-2017), Mfmst (04-25-2017), poshandpoodles (04-17-2017)
Old 04-16-2017, 06:23 PM   #3 (permalink)
Member
Points: 469, Level: 9 Points: 469, Level: 9 Points: 469, Level: 9
Activity: 46.6% Activity: 46.6% Activity: 46.6%
Last Achievements
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 89
Thanks: 7
Thanked 82 Times in 52 Posts
Default

Thanks for the input Verve. I guess that makes sense, because a breeder would probably only keep and show 1 dog for every 3-4 or more bitches. So would you say that finishing a bitch is that much harder than a dog? Or is the competition stiffer in dogs?
chinchillafuzzy is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to chinchillafuzzy For This Useful Post:
poshandpoodles (04-17-2017), Verve (04-17-2017)
 
Old 04-16-2017, 07:05 PM   #4 (permalink)
Senior Member
Points: 413,676, Level: 100 Points: 413,676, Level: 100 Points: 413,676, Level: 100
Activity: 23.4% Activity: 23.4% Activity: 23.4%
Last Achievements
 
CharismaticMillie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Poodle Type: Standard
Location: Missouri
Posts: 6,328
Thanks: 3,725
Thanked 7,115 Times in 2,782 Posts
Default

The competition is much greater in bitches. Not only do you need to beat more bitches to earn points as discussed above, the overall quality of bitches showing is often higher than the overall quality of dogs showing as well.
CharismaticMillie is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to CharismaticMillie For This Useful Post:
Mfmst (04-25-2017), poshandpoodles (04-17-2017), Verve (04-16-2017)
Old 04-16-2017, 07:18 PM   #5 (permalink)
Member
Points: 469, Level: 9 Points: 469, Level: 9 Points: 469, Level: 9
Activity: 46.6% Activity: 46.6% Activity: 46.6%
Last Achievements
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 89
Thanks: 7
Thanked 82 Times in 52 Posts
Default

Thanks CM! It is so strange to me because I feel it should be the opposite - since the dogs in general have more offspring (I would think since they can easily sire many litters.) But on the other hand I can kind of see why it is this way as well. It seems that in many of the less popular breeds the stakes are a little more even. What an adventure
chinchillafuzzy is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to chinchillafuzzy For This Useful Post:
Mfmst (04-25-2017), poshandpoodles (04-17-2017), Verve (04-16-2017)
Old 04-16-2017, 07:38 PM   #6 (permalink)
Senior Member
Points: 413,676, Level: 100 Points: 413,676, Level: 100 Points: 413,676, Level: 100
Activity: 23.4% Activity: 23.4% Activity: 23.4%
Last Achievements
 
CharismaticMillie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Poodle Type: Standard
Location: Missouri
Posts: 6,328
Thanks: 3,725
Thanked 7,115 Times in 2,782 Posts
Default

A dog can sire many more litters, but it's really the bitches that make a breeding program. And I think with the smaller hobby show breeder being more and more common, in contrast to the huge kennels of the past, it can be more difficult for these types of breeders to really manage both intact dogs and bitches, making bitches the priority to show, finish and move forward with. In some cases, a breeder might have a really nice dog in a litter, but since a bitch is more practical than a dog to keep, they would either not show that dog and keep a bitch instead, or keep both and finish and place the dog.
CharismaticMillie is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to CharismaticMillie For This Useful Post:
Mfmst (04-25-2017), poshandpoodles (04-17-2017), Verve (04-17-2017)
Old 04-16-2017, 07:47 PM   #7 (permalink)
Member
Points: 469, Level: 9 Points: 469, Level: 9 Points: 469, Level: 9
Activity: 46.6% Activity: 46.6% Activity: 46.6%
Last Achievements
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 89
Thanks: 7
Thanked 82 Times in 52 Posts
Default

True, thanks for clearing that up for me! I haven't ever owned a breed that had such a huge discrepancy, point-wise, between the sexes. It's so interesting that some breeds have to work so so much harder for that Ch title. Makes me respect all of the spoos (especially the girls) with their championships a whole lot more.

I haven't looked at UKC point schedules in ages but does anyone know if there is a similar phenomenon in spoos with UKC?
chinchillafuzzy is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to chinchillafuzzy For This Useful Post:
poshandpoodles (04-17-2017)
Old 04-17-2017, 03:23 AM   #8 (permalink)
Senior Member
Points: 28,150, Level: 100 Points: 28,150, Level: 100 Points: 28,150, Level: 100
Activity: 9.9% Activity: 9.9% Activity: 9.9%
Last Achievements
 
spindledreams's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Names of dogs: Jazz, Apollo, Twilight, Cole
Poodle Type: Standards
Location: wyoming
Posts: 1,028
Thanks: 1,135
Thanked 1,588 Times in 666 Posts
Default

No as the UKC rules and points are much different. They remain the same for every sex of every breed. ie 10 points for a 1st place in a regular class, 15 points for best male or female, 10 points for best of winners. The points are cumulative so class dog can earn as many as 35 points in a show. To earn their championship a dog must:
  • Have a minimum of 100 championship points
  • Points must be earned under at least three different
    UKC licensed Judges,
  • Win three Best Male/Female (or higher) classes at
    three different shows with competition under three
    different UKC licensed Judges.

Please note the competition wins can come from within the breed OR from a Group placement.
AND sigh yes it is possible to get over 100 points with out getting your title if you lack those competition wins.

To be honest in UKC the title to look for is Grand Champion as those are about as hard to get as in AKC if not slightly harder.
__________________
In the south when the wind gets to 75mph they give it a name and call it a hurricane. Here we say it is a bit windy...
spindledreams is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to spindledreams For This Useful Post:
poshandpoodles (04-17-2017)
Old 04-17-2017, 06:15 AM   #9 (permalink)
Senior Member
Points: 2,901, Level: 35 Points: 2,901, Level: 35 Points: 2,901, Level: 35
Activity: 58.1% Activity: 58.1% Activity: 58.1%
Last Achievements
 
Verve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Names of dogs: Phoebe, Parker
Poodle Type: Standard
Posts: 333
Thanks: 662
Thanked 687 Times in 256 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by spindledreams View Post

To be honest in UKC the title to look for is Grand Champion as those are about as hard to get as in AKC if not slightly harder.
I want to clarify what you were saying there: are you saying a UKC grand is equal/harder than an AKC grand, or that a UKC grand is equal/harder than an AKC CH? I don't agree with either statement.
Verve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2017, 08:41 AM   #10 (permalink)
Member
Points: 469, Level: 9 Points: 469, Level: 9 Points: 469, Level: 9
Activity: 46.6% Activity: 46.6% Activity: 46.6%
Last Achievements
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 89
Thanks: 7
Thanked 82 Times in 52 Posts
Default

Thank you for laying that out for me Spindledreams! Now that you said all of that it is coming back to me - has been years since I took anything in both AKC and UKC rings. I forgot how much easier UKC is. I should have finished my dogs in UKC back when I showed there as I'm sure both of them must have been around 50 pts or more. So that makes me think that it wouldn't be too hard to finish a really nice bitch in a weekend at the UKC shows, as long as there was some competition. I definitely plan to show UKC with this pup and finish her Ch.

I am also going to do some AKC too (all the pro handlers will be so happy to have another dog to beat haha) but the difficulty in getting AKC points makes me think that I will have to do it as a strictly for fun thing. But I get the feeling that I will have a lot of support from the breeder/mentor, so if that happens then who knows what could be possible
chinchillafuzzy is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to chinchillafuzzy For This Useful Post:
Mfmst (04-25-2017), poshandpoodles (04-17-2017), Verve (04-17-2017)
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
is there any real point in registering my spoo with the AkC? swimmergirl247 Poodle Talk 24 06-22-2015 05:00 AM
AKC Registration # Question karenm0 Poodle Talk 2 02-10-2013 05:21 PM
opinons on vaccination schedules for toy poodles Ryker-&-Canyon Poodle Health 11 01-16-2013 04:22 AM
One AKC show question Winnow Showing 3 11-18-2010 09:31 AM
Puppy schedules are amazing KPoos Poodle Talk 3 12-26-2009 08:49 AM


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:40 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
All (C) PoodleForum.com
PetGuide.com
Basset Hound Forum Doberman Forum Golden Retriever Forum Beagle Forum
Boxer Forum Dog Forum Pit Bull Forum Poodle Forum
Bulldog Forum Fish Forum Havanese Forum Maltese Forum
Cat Forum German Shepherd Forum Labradoodle Forum Yorkie Forum Hedgehog Forum
Chihuahua Forum Retriever Breeds Cichlid Forum Dart Frog Forum Mice Breeder Forum