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Showing A place to discuss all aspects of Breed Show Competition, AKC or UKC or other. Questions, thoughts, brags.

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Old 01-04-2013, 04:09 PM   #11 (permalink)
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That is great that you want to show your puppy in conformation. First realize the dog is not judged on his pedigree, so regardless if it is good or bad there is no bearing. The dog should be judged on what it is on any certain day. That being said, "the devil is in the details" and not many do the details as well as the professional handlers. Standard Poodles are really considered a "handler's breed", saying that not to scare you but to have you realize what you are up against. It is hard enough to learn all the ropes of showing a dog in the AKC ring, besides all the details of grooming and spray ups. I highly suggest you go to class, you learn ring procedure and then you attend UKC shows first. They use the same ring procedure for the most part and you learn how to present your dog, at the same time hopefully earning a championship title or more. Professional handlers are not allowed to show dogs unless they own them, and there are no hair products, such as hairspray allowed. There is also no disqualification for trims, or lack of, the judges help you if they know you are "new" and most of the exhibitors are very friendly. If you dog is registered with AKC or CKC (Canadian Kennel Club) you can register him with UKC and get started. I show in both venues and enjoy both, but have to say AKC can really give you a beating and take some of the enjoyment out of what should be a good time with your dog. Here is the link for UKC, they don't always have shows in every area, but always worth checking out if you can find some within driving distance for you. United Kennel Club: Home Good luck and I hope we hear about your experience within time.
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:53 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I show both UKC and AKC. If you wish to show AKC, you can comfortably handle yourself in the puppy classes 6-9 mo pup and 9-12 mo. Otherwise, you will not want to show open. Show Amateur owner handler when you can. It gives you only other amateurs against which to compete and often gets you into the breed ring.

I joined both the UKC poodle club (UPBA) and the local AKC poodle club in the Carolinas as well as my local AKC club. When going to AKC shows, I have plenty of friends who are there. Yes UKC is much easier. In fact one of Karat's competitors helped me prepare her for the ring. And, since UKC does not allow hairspray a floppy topknot is acceptable. in AKC, although hairspray is technically not allowed nor are wiggies, I doubt past puppy class that you will see any entries that have not been sprayed up. When Karat goes into the ring, if she goes with me, she still is prepared by a pro handler.

Don't be discouraged about attending AKC shows. In my area, there are more AKC shows than UKC so just close your eyes and try it. If you are concerned, try some of the AKC club matches first to get a feel for showing. Most AKC clubs run matches several times during the year.
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Old 01-05-2013, 04:35 AM   #13 (permalink)
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I would never discourage some from someone wanting to get up and show their dgs, but I have concerns about this...if the breeder doesn't show how can they tell you a puppy will be show quality? Was the litter evaluated by an outside source?

I've experienced first hand that you can't buy a show quality animals from someone who doesn't show (if you're a novice that doesn't understand structure or the breed standard yet like I was).

If you're serious about showing go to shows...leave your dog at home and meet people talk to them, explain the situation and see if they'd be willing to evaluate your dog...and understand if you ask for an honest opinion you will get it from poodle people hahaha!

UKC sounds like a good option though
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Old 01-05-2013, 05:36 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Keithsomething, you are absolutely wrong. There have been a number of AKC champions that did not come from breeders that show. Some breeders do not have the deep pockets to pay handlers to finish their dogs so elect not to show. That does not mean that the dogs are inferior. It only means that either the breeders don't wish to spend thousands to finish a dog or that they do not have the skills to do it themselves. Do you breed or show?
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Old 01-05-2013, 06:20 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcoislandmom View Post
Keithsomething, you are absolutely wrong. There have been a number of AKC champions that did not come from breeders that show. Some breeders do not have the deep pockets to pay handlers to finish their dogs so elect not to show. That does not mean that the dogs are inferior. It only means that either the breeders don't wish to spend thousands to finish a dog or that they do not have the skills to do it themselves. Do you breed or show?
Although it is possible to get a puppy that someone thinks is show quality from a non showing breeder, it puts the owner at a SERIOUS disadvantage. You have to understand what you are doing, both in the ring and on the grooming table to be able to accomplish an AKC championship with a standard poodle. What most NOVICE people do not understand is that with Standard poodles you will be going against proffessional handlers. That can be compared to playing golf with Tiger Woods. The handlers are paid in the range of $85-100 everytime they show a dog, they go every weekend, they travel hundreds of miles to go to shows where they know the judging, this IS their livley hood, they are there to win. Do they ALWAYS win, NO, but more chances then not they do, and rarely are they beat by a Novice exhibitor for POINTS, yes you might win your class, but only WINNERS receives the championship points. Sorry but showing a Standard Poodle at AKC shows is not something you should close your eyes and walk into blindly unless you have extra income to throw away --I am talking from years of experience. I purchased a puppy from a breeder who did not show, the sire and dam were not champions, but everyone behind them were, and I KNEW what I was doing, the breeder did not. I had already bred and showed in the AKC ring with another breed, and had several champions that I had bred and understood structure. What I did not understand was grooming, or the technique of showing a poodle, which is different then other breeds. I did finish my dog completely owner handled, at the age of three years, but when I bred a dog I felt was "good" I sent him to a handler, because for me it was too much work. (Well it is OK if you win, but if you loose, it is too much work.) I felt in the long run it was less expensive to pay a handler then for me to run all over, and at my age I didn't feel I had to time to devote to a single dog. So when I am talking to a novice person, and to me novice is someone who has not had an AKC champion of any breed, I suggest they start with UKC, the money spent to travel to an UKC show is better spent then going to a hundred AKC shows and going home with not much more then a class ribbon. And I agree with Keith, go to AKC shows without your dog first and get the feel of it, then make your decision on which route you think would work for you.
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Old 01-05-2013, 07:59 AM   #16 (permalink)
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[QUOTE=Jacknic;276449 I did finish my dog completely owner handled, at the age of three years, but when I bred a dog I felt was "good" I sent him to a handler, because for me it was too much work. (Well it is OK if you win, but if you loose, it is too much work.) I felt in the long run it was less expensive to pay a handler then for me to run all over, and at my age I didn't feel I had to time to devote to a single dog.[/QUOTE]

I was wondering about the cost aspect. If the goal is to own an AKC champion, then it sounds like it is less expensive to have a professional handler.

The woman I worked for had most of her dogs finish in 6-9 months (one was 3 months I think!) under a professional handler. That got them the championship she needed to justify breeding a litter every couple of years, but the pup back home on her couch as soon as possiable.

It sounds like a lot of people are saying if your goal is to have some fun showing UKC may be the way to go, being a bit more forgiving of handler errors, etc - because if the goal is to enjoy showing your dog it helps to win occassionally
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Old 01-05-2013, 09:20 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Pluto, you mentioned that the woman you worked for finished her dogs at 6-9 months and one a 3 months. I would like her name and kennel name. That must have been a phenomenal standard. BTW, you cannot finish a 3 month old. They are in unlicensed classes. If you are interested in a handler, the cost of finishing can varying widely depending upon how good your dog is. A great dog, in the hands of a good handler could finish in 3-4 months and cost, with boarding, etc. roughly $3000. I know of one lady who has a mini that has been in the hands of a top handler going on 9 months and has not finished yet. Her investment has been 7500 so far. The mini just isn't that good. Yes, she may ultimately finish her ... in Alaska or Puerto Rico. 3-4 months is a reasonable time to allow a handler to attempt to finish your dog. If they cannot achieve the task in that time period, and there is only 1 major attained, I would tell you that the dog might not have what is needed to champion. Remember, with enough money, you might still finish that dog.
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Old 01-05-2013, 09:43 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Marcoislandmom she had a handler finish her dog in three months He was 11 months old. I see now that the sentence was not as clear as I though.
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Old 01-05-2013, 09:53 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcoislandmom View Post
If you are interested in a handler, the cost of finishing can varying widely depending upon how good your dog is. A great dog, in the hands of a good handler could finish in 3-4 months and cost, with boarding, etc. roughly $3000.
My dog finished his championship quickly, within 3 months, missing being a puppy champion by a couple of days. And it cost a heck of a lot more than $3,000!!!!!!!!!

Finishing at $3,000 would be pretty unusual!
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Old 01-05-2013, 10:48 AM   #20 (permalink)
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I looked at the UKC event list and there are none near me or even close for the whole year. I am going to try some local shows or close by, if she doesn't work out that's fine, I prob test the waters with local shows. We will start conformation classes in feb. I am not opposed to professional handlers if she has what it takes. But mainly just wanted to test the waters. From what I have heard it is pretty much impossible to just go and buy a show puppy If your a newbie) you have to have shown or be big name kennel. I may go and realize it is not for me. But I feel the need to try. I rather try and fail than not try at all. All this information is helpful the good and the bad. I have realistic expectations.
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