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Old 12-30-2012, 04:01 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Marcoislandmom: My least favorite experience with an electronic fence was when an adult male Akita, supposedly contained by one, broke through the barrier to savagely attack our former 17 lb. dog as we were walking by. The kicker; he'd apparently done it before! For all the reasons already mentioned, along with that horrible, unforgettable experience, e-fences will never get my endorsement. Glad you reached out for members' opinions on this. Your spoo will be too!
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Old 12-30-2012, 04:17 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I think invisable fences work really well for many dogs, but are probably not that helpful for most standards. Invisable fences require training and supervision. Once you have invested the training into a standard and just the basic supervision, the fencing is redundant - because your dog already knows the limits. Before using the fence you use flags, a leash, and the collar (that peeps as they get close to the fence) to train the dog to where the fencing is and show them their limits. The typical standard is pretty smart and this type of training, if reinforced is usually sufficent without the fencing (backup).

Where I have seen the invisable fencing work really well-

1) inside a fenced yard to keep a dog out of flower beds and other areas. In this case the the fencing reinforces the limtis you have already trained to the dog for when left unsupervised in the fenced yard. That can include keeping dogs away from a fence line that they could otherwise dog under/go over.

2) To reinforce the limits as trained above in a subborn breed that may need additional backup to be trustworthy when offleash in the unfenced yard. It really isn't safe to use an invisable fence in an unsecured yard without supervision due to dangers to the dog "stuck" in the unfenced yard (ie no way to escape from a loose dog or other harassment without shock). And because a poodle is typically pretty trainable and less likely to be a "runner", the fencing is usually expensive and/or difficult to install and not really necissary for a trained and supervised poodle. You can get the same results from your dog with the same amount of training, without the investment in the fencing - and you are not then tempted to leave your dog in an unsafe situation (ie in a yard with just an invisable fence).
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Old 12-31-2012, 06:05 AM   #13 (permalink)
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I'm not as experienced a many of the members but I would also not use invisible fence as well. My neighbor had one with their young golden retriever and she used to be so friendly but I think she started to associate the shock with us because we would call her name (not realizing there was a invisible fence) and she's tried to come but couldn't. A month later or so she became really aggressive towards us every time we said hi to her so we stopped and eventually my neighbor just kept the dog inside. Also I think if you want dogs to be outside and play I think you could teach them (with trainer or by yourself) how to stick close to you and not go outside the grass or something like that and good recall. I've seen it done with some dogs. We don't have a fenced in yard because I live at an apartment but Ido have a yard. I basically tie my spoo with a 50ft leash and make sure the knots are right (I test it a few times before letting him play outside). Of course I don't leave him alone outside but watch him explore and sometimes play fetch with him.


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Old 12-31-2012, 06:43 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcoislandmom View Post
Thanks for the detailed reply. We are not allowed to have fencing in our community which is why I was thinking about the invisible fence. Given the information you provided, I will probably not do it. Thanks again.
I live on a golf course in a private gated community and therefore not allowed a fence. The golf course backs up to a reserve so we have deer and all kinda of things wandering around on the golf course behind us.

I have 2 standard poodles with a high chase drive and I do have an invisible fence. I've had it for almost two years. For me and my dogs it has been awesome. I'm not saying it is for everyone but I do believe that the PRE training prior to it being active is a HUGE part! I did tons of research before we chose.... And by the way that "malfunction" story about a dog being shocked endlessly is a misnomer. That has never happened. In fact the fence can only give a correction for a very short distance in front of... Behind and above the underground wire. I can drive my dogs off my property in my car with their collars on without any correction. My dogs will run the length of my yard after a deer or a squirrel but stop short of the line. And the fence gives a beep warning before a correction so if they get too close they can choose to turn back. By the way.... The correction isn't the same for every dog.... There are very light corrections that u can barely feel (yes I have felt what both my dogs would feel... Which are different from each other ) or it can be more severe which may be needed for a bigger heavier dog like my neighbors mastiff.

Rusty and Lola LOVE the freedom to come in and out... I still pay very close attention when they are out and we still take 2.5 to 3 mile walks almost every day.

If you're interested on the PRE training let me know. It is KEY!


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Old 12-31-2012, 06:59 AM   #15 (permalink)
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I think people assume the dogs get too close and get shocked all the time.... It's just not true... They know exactly how far they can go... It is no diff then teaching them the boundaries of their yard with a long lead except there is a predictable correction 100% of the time for them which is very effective in training. Here is a very short clip to show u that they know exactly how far to go.

http://youtu.be/IlZhfxDo2q8


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Old 12-31-2012, 08:36 AM   #16 (permalink)
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I think it would be okay depending on your dog!

I had a neighbor with two dobes and fences were not allowed (unless surrounding a pool) and one would never cross it or seem bothered by it, the other one would take the hit to run into our yard and play with us haha. It was like he would weigh the pros and cons of being corrected vs playing with his neighbors, he almost always chose to run across it.

So depends on how you feel your dog would do!
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Old 12-31-2012, 09:06 AM   #17 (permalink)
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I think it would be okay depending on your dog!

I had a neighbor with two dobes and fences were not allowed (unless surrounding a pool) and one would never cross it or seem bothered by it, the other one would take the hit to run into our yard and play with us haha. It was like he would weigh the pros and cons of being corrected vs playing with his neighbors, he almost always chose to run across it.

So depends on how you feel your dog would do!
I agree it's not for all... I know of one Person in my neighborhood (among very many who live on the course and use one as well) who did not have success ...but I must prejudicely say... It wasn't a standard poodle lol and actually it was a very tiny little dog. Neither the company nor the owner wanted to turn up the correction level any higher so the company retrieved the fence equipment and refunded her money..


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Old 12-31-2012, 09:15 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Yeah, and I mean really I'm not a big advocate of e-training or e-fences, but you have to look at the alternatives. Do you live in an area with lots of open water/pools, a golf range, lots of small kids, a busy street? I would say the 'dangers' of having absolutely no-fence can outweigh the discomfort of an e-fence. But it depends on your dog, and your own personal level of comfort using the method. Some people are very vocally against these things, but it is your dog, and if you believe the associated risks outweigh the benefits then don't use one.

I think the greatest risks would be that it doesn't work for your dog/your lifestyle, or that your dog learns to associate the shock with things it's trying to investigate such as your neighbors etc. They're definitely not for unsupervised use like how my neighbors used them.
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Old 12-31-2012, 11:49 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Aside from the potentially dangerous issues already discussed about e fences, there is one other problem that doesn't seem to have been mentioned which is that there is nothing about them that would prevent someone from stealing your dog off your property. Our fence is not just for keeping Lily and Peeves inside, but for keeping those who might dognap or otherwise do harm to them out! Anyone who spends any time near our property knows they are here and also has probably figured out that we think they are worth something. I wouldn't want to send them out to play and find they had been replaced by a ransom note. Maybe this sounds crazy but I've heard of this happening.
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Old 12-31-2012, 12:32 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lily cd re View Post
Aside from the potentially dangerous issues already discussed about e fences, there is one other problem that doesn't seem to have been mentioned which is that there is nothing about them that would prevent someone from stealing your dog off your property. Our fence is not just for keeping Lily and Peeves inside, but for keeping those who might dognap or otherwise do harm to them out! Anyone who spends any time near our property knows they are here and also has probably figured out that we think they are worth something. I wouldn't want to send them out to play and find they had been replaced by a ransom note. Maybe this sounds crazy but I've heard of this happening.
First I'll reply to something MaryLynn said..... as far as pups being confused about neighbors and such ... That is completely a non issue .... Not only can my neighbors stand on their side and talk to my dogs but they do it every day.... Rusty and Lola absolutely know where the boundary line is on all 4 sides of the property.... They always stay on our side... Wag their tails when bein greeted and then go about their business... I have neighbors that live a few streets over that walk their dogs to my house every morning around 8 to play with mine Bc they know we are outside. Rusty and Lola wait patiently until their visitors are completely inside the boundary line before they approach to play.... My kids bus stop is 3 houses away... Every morning and afternoon rusty and lola are outside watching all the kids walk to and home from bus stop... the neighborhood kids call their names and say hi as they walk by.... they watch and wag and are excited but they stay within the boundary... And sometime i will stand on the side walk which is just outside the boundary and talk to one of the bus stop kid's mom who has her big dog on leash and again mine will sit and watch and wag and whatnot but on the inside of the boundary.... they are not confused in the slightest and i don't have to remind them at all. That part is simply training and I feel sorry for any dog that wasn't trained and doesn't understand where or y a correction is happening to them.

I "can" leave them outside unattended without worry of them crossing or being corrected because they just know and they haven't done it in the last 2 years.

Now .....leaving them outside unattended to be stolen is a whole nother story and I DO think about that.

This is why I said in a previous post I really don't leave them unattended.... They do go out on their own a bit here and there but when I'm not out there with them I am constantly looking out windows doing spot checks. I would never assume they are fine and they never ever go out alone when it's dark.

If I had a choice .... Yes... Absolutely I would have a traditional fence but I don't have a choice and this is a good alternative... You just have to be responsible about it like any other training.

If my dogs didnt understand and kept shocking themselves I would not have it at all and just use leashes.... I don't want them to get shocked .... I want them to understand and respect the boundary and that's exactly how it is here. They run like mad all over the yard but stay away from the boundary on all 4 sides.


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