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Old 02-16-2013, 04:55 PM   #31 (permalink)
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My concern at this point would be for the children. Twenty five years ago we wanted a beagle for our 12 year old son. We contacted a reputable show breeder, who had a very pretty six month old female that had been sold to a family with a four year old child. The child developed an allergy to the dog, so she came back to the breeder.

I made a 14 hour round trip drive to get her. She was lovely, we felt lucky to get her, and our son was delighted. For a few weeks, everything was fine, but then she started acting aggressive and threatening at times. I didn't see the first two or three events--it happened while I was at work--when my husband and son were each the object of her threatening behavior. I couldn't believe it, but my husband was insistent that there was no reason, nothing had changed, she hadn't been hurt or frightened. He said she was fine one minute, very aggressive the next. Eventually I saw it myself. She suddenly stopped, got a blank look in her eyes, and began to growl in a really menacing fashion. I called the breeder, who said, with no preamble, "Have her put down, and we'll see that you get another dog." I offered to bring the dog back to her, but she was adamant. "Just have her put down." I took the dog to our vet, who said, "The breeder is right. This dog needs to be put down. She's dangerous." I read later that there is some type of neurological dysfunction, at least in beagles, that causes abnormal behavior/aggression and cannot be treated. (The dog we were given in exchange was a sweet, affectionate male named Buzz, who never gave us a moment's worry.)

I've wondered if the dog displayed that sort of behavior toward the four year old whose family returned her. Perhaps they didn't tell the breeder the real reason they didn't want the dog. I've wondered if the breeder knew actually knew and hoped it was due to the dog being mistreated in some way. I've wondered if the breeder had had that happen with others of her dogs. In any event, I don't think the breeder was surprised. The one thing I haven't wondered about is whether we did the right thing. No doubt in my mind the dog was a danger to all three of us.

The point of my story is that there may be nothing you can do to help this dog, who does sound dangerously unpredictable to me.
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Old 02-16-2013, 06:35 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by mama24_7 View Post
our hearts are being torn to shreds while we wait and wait and wait for midatlantic poodle rescue to do something. Partially it is our fault things are taking so long. We had to gather paperwork and we were waiting for questions to be answered. Emails are not replied to for days at a time or at all.

What to do?
Call Cindy at Mid-Atlantic Poodle Rescue (MAPR) between the hours of 8 a.m. and 8 p.m. (410)963-0079 and tell her the situation has grown more dire and dangerous since your initial contact, which I think may have been around February 6th or thereabouts.

I would bet my own mpoo's life the Rescue is in no way dragging their feet here. As indicated on their website, "MAPR does not have a facility. Dogs surrendered by owners or pulled from shelters are placed in foster homes or other protected placements and cared for by our volunteer members until they can be adopted." They may be working to find a space for Obie right now, if you've completed and submitted the requisite surrender paperwork. But I would urge you to make contact with Cindy to see if it's possible for you to be moved up in the cue since getting Obie out of your home is absolutely urgent and imperative for your children's safety.

I am uncertain if it would help, but I do know some people in Poodle Rescue in other states (NJ & CT) who I can contact for their ideas if you are unsuccessful in getting things expedited with MAPR. I know no one feels the urgency and frustration and heart ache of this situation more than you. I know you're doing what you can, I will gladly try to help. Others may be in a position to as well. Stay strong, keep your children safe, and be insistent that Obie needs to be placed ASAP.
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Old 02-16-2013, 08:04 PM   #33 (permalink)
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I had somehow missed all of this until now.

I am so sorry that you are dealing with this. I agree that the children are paramount in this and Obie needs all the help he can get from the Rescue. I know that finding a placement even temporarily for an aggressive poodle maybe a big part of the problem, but I am sure that they are doing their best and I agree with Chagall's Mom, call them again to let them know how things have escalated.

Some types of personalities are not good around children but will be able to latch on to one person and be a wonderful fit. I will be sending positive thoughts and energy your way hopeful that all will go smoothly from here on out.

Keep us aware and don't give up. This too shall pass and things will get better.

Do not let this turn you off to poodles. I have had many that were the best around even very small children. And this is why some folks are so against backyard breeders, because you may or may not get a good temperament from one, you may never know the temperament of both parents. But even pups from the same litter can and do have drastically different temperaments. I have had one sibling and my grandparents another and the dogs were miles apart in personality. One took after the dad and the other after the dam and I got the best of the bunch.


This was why my mom was so choosy when it came to bringing home our dogs. She said she was looking for a certain thing in a dog, and until she found it, none were coming home. I hated it at the time, but I have grown to realize she did all of us a favor.


Just as all people have different issues and personalities so do dogs, and you just need to find your perfect fit.

Blessings to you and yours.
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Old 02-17-2013, 12:10 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Yes, we have been in contact with poodle rescue since February 2nd. You are right, Cindy is probably scrambling to find a foster spot for a biting dog or does not understand the way things are going downhill. We have had difficulty communicating. Emails seemed to be crossing paths and not getting delivered. We will be making a call tomorrow to make sure she does understand what is happening. Also, we sent her pictures of Obie and she said he did not look like a puppy to her. I don't know what to do with that. Maybe because he has a lot of curl at 8 months he doesn't look like a puppy? He wwas 4 months when we got him and he has gained a couple pounds and an inch in the past 4 months. I don't see how he is not a puppy. I mean, I don't think the breeder lied to us and I would think the vet would have mentioned if Obie did not seem to be the age we thought he was.

I know it is easy to assume that my children have done something and, since I am the mom, nothing I can say will change that assumption. It is a reasonable assumption. All I can say is that I know my children and as far as I can tell they have never been anything but kind to Obie. Nobody has tattled on anyone else and I'm sure they would, especially when they heard we were going to get rid of him. In general, though people assume a house ith 6 children must be crazy and the kids must run wild, that is not at all true in our home. People often comment on my children's good behavior in all situations. So, I tend to think that they are not the cause of Obie's issues. However, I completely understand why someone would think that, especially as you all don't know me or my children. You only know what I have written. Makes perfect sense.

I wonder if, after giving a dog up to poodle rescue, will we be able to adopt a dog from them?
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Old 02-17-2013, 12:54 PM   #35 (permalink)
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I wish I could do more to help than just offer moral support, but I hope you get Obie into rescue quickly, and without anyone getting hurt in the meantime.
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Old 02-17-2013, 01:10 PM   #36 (permalink)
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mama24_7: You're right, none of us are there and we don't know firsthand what's going on. Also, we just "met" you recently, as a new member. I'm glad you're going to press on to try to get Obie into Poodle Rescue. I know some rescues simply will not as a matter of policy accept a dog who's a biter, and I can understand that. Your story may prove to be a good cautionary tale for others, perhaps allowing them to make a decision about whether to keep a dog that seems ill suited to their home before it escalates to being a biter.

As to Obie's approximate age, I would imagine your vet would indeed know after one quick look in his mouth. Teeth tell a lot! That brings a thought to mind, would your vet be willing to kennel Obie until he's placed somewhere? I am fortunate to have a wonderful vet of longstanding and he routinely does this for people caught in a bind. He also lives adjacent to his veterinary practice so it's a rather unique situation. As far as Obie's breeder, I hope you can consider her trustworthy. I thought, perhaps mistakenly, you may have had some qualms about her after-the-fact. Doesn't matter, what matters is the present and future. Right now keeping your children safe and getting Obie placed is where the focus needs to be and is.

Since your vet hasn't identified anything being physically wrong with Obie, I hope this is a just a case of him being a young dog who's overwhelmed in his present environment and he can go on to live a long and happy life in another. There are breeders, and rescues, who refuse to place a pup in a home with very young children out of concern for the welfare of all. And frankly I can understand their thinking. But back to your situation, it sounds to me like both you and MAPR are working toward the best possible outcome here. I'm keeping you in my thoughts and hope you hear encouraging news soon. Take care!
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Old 02-18-2013, 06:47 AM   #37 (permalink)
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mama24_7: I may have come upon another expedient rescue option for you. This poodle rescue may be closer and may be able to help you out with Obie.

Delmarva Poodle Rescue
Adopting Poodles in Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, the District of Columbia, and parts of Pennsylvania and New Jersey | Delmarva Poodle Rescue

You might want to contact them. I have a poodle friend who lives in VA and is an avid suppporter of rescues. Depending on where you live, she may be able to swing by and pick up Obie to take him over to the Rescue for you. If you decide to work with Delmarva on rehoming Obie, and you wish to, just PM me the town where you live and I'll see if my friend can help with the logistics. I went to bed and woke up thinking of your family and Obie, can you tell??

Also, you might explore the option I posted previously of perhaps contact these good folks:

Tidelands Poodle Club of Virginia
tidelandspoodleclub.org
Rescue: Jane Carroll
(757) 258-9322
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Old 02-18-2013, 08:10 AM   #38 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mama24_7 View Post
I wonder if, after giving a dog up to poodle rescue, will we be able to adopt a dog from them?
I don't know what the policies of poodle rescue groups are, but all I can say is I certainly hope that you would be able to adopt a poodle from a rescue! From everything you say, it sounds as if you are being very responsible in working through an extremely difficult situation. I really hope that your pup can be placed with an experienced poodle rescue volunteer who would be able to evaluate the dog in a child-free environment.

An even-tempered poodle can be a great addition to a big busy happy family. I hope that you and your family have a happier experience ahead of you.
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Old 02-20-2013, 08:12 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Obie has gone to Jane Carrol with Tidelands Poodle Club. My husband drove down to Richmond to give Obie to her. When she tried to let him sniff her hand he pulled back snarled and I think he snapped at her. There is a possibility he will end up being put down. Honestly, I think that might be for the best since Obie seemed to have a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde personality. Clearly he and we are the victims of a backyard breeder. I guess we should have known better, though I keep looking at his sister who is calm, peaceful, sweet, even tempered, and patient with children and wondering how they came from the same parents.

It was good that my husband took Obie and heard what Jane and her husband had to say. She seemed to think a miniature poodle would be a good match for our family, provided the poodle were well bred.

She also assured us that nothing our children did or we did could have made Obie the way he is. She and her husband both said there seems to be something wrong in his head. I guess that is good to hear, I hate to think my children had somehow broken the dog. It is also heartbreaking to hear. Poor Obie. It makes sense and explains the fact that he was a totally different dog until about a month ago. I was looking back at our family photos to find some for my homeschool blog and I had a hard time finding photos without a poodle pup in them. He was part of our family.

Having Oberon in our family for the two and a half months he was himself were wonderful. I went from not really wanting to get a dog to loving him wholeheartedly. Our 4 year old was petrified of all dogs, so much so that she was even scared of stuffed animals at one point. As soon as she saw Oberon her fears were healed. She would tell me that other dogs might make her a little scared, but she knew Obie would keep her safe and would never hurt her. It's going to be hard on her to lose him, but I had to keep her safe and if he ever had hurt her things would have been awful. Oberon was good for our family, both in his coming and even in his going. We learned a little bit about ourselves and a lot about dogs over the past few weeks.

Having a fluffy pup snuggle with my cold feet, play fetch with us in the yard, lay next to me while I teach the children, snuggling on our bed, sitting with his head tilted just so as he watched me change a diaper (why does the naked puppy not go outside for that?), gently taking cheerios from the toddler's hand when she called him.....there is now a hole in our family. We just might want to try again, carefully this time...ever so very very very carefully. My only reservation is having my children fall in love with a pup again and then having that loved one yanked from them. So, we will be praying over this, making sure we are moving slowly and choosing wisely who we allow into our family. I would not be surprised if we end up wanting another poodle, so you may hear from us again.

Thank you for your ears, your advice, and more than anything your patience. I have never had a family pet go like this and I truly had no idea what was going on or what to do and I know at times I may have been obnoxious. Thanks very much for helping.
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Old 02-21-2013, 02:54 AM   #40 (permalink)
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mama 24_ 7: Your family has been through quite an ordeal! You handled it with much grace and good sense. I'm terribly sorry for how things unfolded with Obie. And like you, I'm sure, I'm eternally grateful to Jane Carrol and the wonderful folks at the Tideland Poodle Club. I knew they would help. I'm so very glad you turned Obie over to them. Peace will come to him under their care, it sounds like he is somehow very unwell. I know your family must be shocked, sad and bewildered. But you now also know you are blameless; though you knew that all along, you need now have no doubt. You know too there is every possibility of another mpoo joining your family someday. And you know better how to go about finding a reputable breeder and the right, healthy pup. All is not lost, though things must seem very bleak. I know you will be a pillar of strength to guide your children through this difficult time. I hope you feel proud of your family, you should! Thank you for your courage, openness and goodness. I hope you will join us again someday, with happier news. Best wishes to you all.
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