Searcher

We have also looked at Paris Poodles but haven't gotten responses to our inquiries lately. We are looking for a small (20-22") red standard. We want a working poodle rather than the foo foo type. Also have negative feelings towards tail docking for what seems to be mostly cosmetic reasons. We basically liked the look of their dogs. However, we are open to other options. We are now at the point in our research to start visiting breeders.

*heather*

The dogs look great on the site! I like their approach.
Reds are a touch pricey but like spoofan said, "if you break it down to what your companion will cost you per each year of its life...it's a bargain,not to mention how you will be enriched!" agreed

cbrand

All Standard Poodles are "working type". The idea that they are froo froo is simply urban legend.

In fact, if you are looking for a Standard with good work ethic, you should be looking at breeders who specifically breed for show or performance. Paris does neither... where are the show, obedience, agility, tracking, hunting titles?

Consider these dogs:

CH Ascot Boucheron Joaillerie CD RN MH
Besides being a Champion show dog, most people would agree that a Master Hunter title is something you can brag about with the boys at any bar in the country. Yet look at her pedigree: http://www.poodlepedigree.com/pedigree.asp?ID=318167
Behind her are generation after generation of Champion show dogs.

AM CH OTCH Cantif's Chasing The Storm UDX8
Holy Cow! Not only a breed Champion but an OTCH which in my opinion is the hardest title of all to obtain. Not only do you have to be able to do all the most difficult obedience exercises, you have to BEAT the other teams who are working at your same level. Plus a UDX8 title means that this dog correctly completed both Open and Utility exercises on the same day 80 TIMES!!!!!! This dog is a working machine. Yet his pedigree is full of Champion show dogs and in fact he is the son of the Standard Poodle who has produced the most show Champions in history.
http://www.poodlepedigree.com/pedigree.asp?ID=10754

I could go on (a lot), but I think I might bore people.

Paris poodles is playing on people's fears about Poodles. They are spinning a story that they think people want to hear. Where I come from we might say they are all hat and no horse. Where are the performance titles that prove the working ability of their breeding dogs? Where are the Breed Ring titles that show that their Poodles conform to standard? (It is very easy to finish a Poodle in Canada). All I see are average to poor quality poodles. Why would anyone pay top $$$ for these dogs? Color? Again, in horses we say... you can't ride color.

Finally a word about tails. I don't love docking tails and if it ever becomes illegal like it is in Europe, I will gladly put the procedure behind me. However, a docked tail is currently part of the look of Poodle. That lovely 12 o'clock tail, wagging back and forth, shows spirit and confidence. It also is helpful if you are trying to keep track of a dog working high grass.

People love to complain about the docked Poodle tail, but no one gives a second thought to the docked tails on German Shorthair Pointers, Vizslas, Weimaraner, or on any of the Terrier breeds. Why is that?

PonkiPoodles

Actually people do... they complain about docking in general and no breed is immune to their complaints.
We own 2 dobermans and I cannot tell you how many times I've had to deal with people saying it's cruel.
Just as I've mentioned in another post.... studies done by the DCA has shown that dobes docked and cropped are more likely to be rehomed that dobes that were not.

I feel if you want to crop and dock it should be your choice - whether it's for cosmetic reasons or not.

roxy25

well said !

spoofan

I used to prefer the look of a docked tail on a poodle.
At the same time I believe that like so many other things we do to dogs,it is done strictly for the benefit of us humans.
It does nothing whatsoever for the dog.
You are essentially cutting off the end of a pup's spine.
They use their tail to navigate.
As time goes on the look of a full,glorious,natural tail on a poodle is really growing on me.
I hope,that North America will join the rest of the world and put a ban on any animal mutilation.

PonkiPoodles

You can enter anything into schutzhund ... but what they do is probably only the tracking and obedience part of it.
Most breeds other than the GSD do not excell in the handler protection, that is why you never see them doing schutzhund. The only breeds other than GSD that I've seen excell at handler protection is pit bulls, rottweilers and dobermans (and then they really need to be bred as working dogs and very few of them end up having the correct bite and/or drive to do schutzhund)

PonkiPoodles

It's true what you say spoofan... many things we do to our dogs... and children and other people are strictly to benefit ourselves.

I've never seen any dog suffer from having their tail docked correctly... it should be docked within a day or two after puppies are born... thus they really do not even feel it since the bone is still extremely soft.

I've never seen docked tails have any affect on a dog's navigation what-so-ever ?????

spoofan

Unless you are the puppy,you cannot tell what they feel or do not feel.
If it was a harmless procedure,enhancing the dog's life in any way,chances are it would not be banned in the civilized world.

roxy25

My understanding that many Europe countries have banned Cropping and docking because people are doing it themselves and using BUTCHER Knifes ..... These people where not cropping and docking at the right age either.

There are many things that are banned because PETA fantatics want total animal liberation.

Does this mean they are right ?................ I don't think so.

I know this subject is controversial but you need to look at what things are banned now and why because a lot of it is just due to shear ignorance.

I really do not care if the dog is docked or not , I do feel if done properly by a vet then there should not be a problem at all.

ALL of this is JMO